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#11
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Slow PC
Noel – Thanks for the added information. I know AOL has its problems and critics. However, for my use and convenience, I have tried to stick with it. Anyway, the reason I started this post was to prepare for Vista. It was my thinking that the new operating system together with a new PC would do away with many AOL delay problems. And, if that turns out to be true, I would have saved me time by not switching to another ISP. I have always had my doubts that AOL worked smoothly with Windows Me. I think Windows Me has been a problem with other applications as well. Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: Simple answer, is no - because almost none of the other ISP's have the same complex layers between themselves and the user. Why does AOL have these layers - because at one time they were needed for a reliable connection on dialup, and AOL built their business model around them, and sell huge amounts of advertising space on the interface. Why can't you use the more normal methods of connection with AOL that everyone else does? because they'd lose advertising revenue, and lose control over their customers. AOL's interface allows them currently to lockout use of routers to share the internet connection, as it does also ICS (unless you jump through a lot of hoops)- you have to pay extra for an 'upgraded' service to get the ability to share an ADSL line switched on in AOL -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Noel – How nice of you to detail AOL’s operation and confirm it with the Resource Meter, etc. And, your example of delays on a fast machine was surprising. I would not have expected that. Do other ISPs have similar delays? Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: AOL is a system hog - I know, I used it (on dialup) for 10 years! It has a habit of updating itself in the background without telling you - and reinstating applications that you thought that you had safely disabled every time you start AOL up. Said applications are frequently the cause of the slowness - and McAfee is worse than most in this respect, particularly in WIn9x systems (the only one worse is Norton, AFAIK). Next time you boot, open the Resource Meter before opening AOL, and watch the available resource drop like a stone. Open System Monitor - and watch the Kernel Processor usage climb to 100% and stay there for the lagtime, and the Swapfile in Use numbers start to climb towards the roof, and stay there. To switch screen names in AOL, the process involves (IIRC) actually unloading AOL and reloading a different instance - and this takes time. The process of starting up AOL itself is a little lesson in how not to write an application, very roughly what happens is (and this is from memory, so could be total BS!):- 1) You click the shortcut 2) this launches WAOL.exe - which in turn the checks the integrity of the installation before doing anything else, and scan your existing network connections 3) if no new connections are found, it begins to load the required background applications 4) once all the background applications are loaded, it then loads the rest of the connector, and eventually you get the request for the screenname/password 5) You click OK on the SN/PW 6)AOL then connects to the local exchange, which then connects to the US servers for verification of the PW/SN, and hands you back to whichever is you local AOL server, which deals with you from then on this then begins the download of the pages, at the same time checking your buddy list, and updating the email database. AOL has a pretty high contention ratio - so there may be a lot of user fighting for the bandwidth that you're using intensively at this time, and they have a right to at least some of it all the time. 7) Eventually, AOL has finished updating everything in sight, and updating the background apps as well, and you get the adverts popping up Even on a fast-ish machine (this one is a non-optimised 3GHz Sempron with 1GB RAM in XP running AOL9 over 1Mb/s BT ADSL) the full process can take 7 seconds to bring up the login screen, and about 15-20 seconds to do the actual login - and that's when I'm already connected to the Net, by another ISP!, add in the negotiation time required, and any slowdowns because you may be using a limited-bandwidth service, and it's easy to see where 45 seconds comes from. HTH -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Noel – The lag time is not always the same, but this is what I normally experience When I first hit the AOL logo to sign on, it can take maybe 15 sec. to get to the sign on page. Now, when I click on the sign on page, it can take maybe another 10 seconds to get to the "welcome" page. Now, to your point of AOL loading a lot of stuff, that is true. I say that because when I am on the sign on page, I can tell AOL is downloading the spyware and antivirus notification. Also, when I first hit the AOL logo and am waiting, my antivirus (supplied by AOL) is loading. So, I can understand some of this is slowing me down. However, what annoys me the most is this. When I click on the sign on page and start loading my "welcome page," all graphics appear except for one small block. And I can wait 20 seconds for it to appear. It’s the same block all the time. And then, what bothers me next is this. When I switch screen names, I have waited up to 45 seconds for the switch to be made. Now, that being said, all of the above usually are the worse at first application. So, I am thinking that after my initial sign on, AOL is done downloading programs whereby follow-up use is faster. But, I need to say also, the above delays, etc have gotten worse in the past year. So, even though AOL can be part of the problem, I am wondering if my PC is contributing some of the delays. My buddy list has two people. Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: AOL can download an awful lot of stuff before it decides to show it!! When you say 'lag' - what are we talking about? Seconds for the first page to complete display, or seconds for a number of pages to be displayed? How many people are in your Buddies list (the more you have there, the longer AOL will take to check to see whether they're online)? -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Dan – Your reference is very interesting. I can see you took some time to organize it. In addition to the information you include, you do a good job in taking time to include the key strokes to activate a feature. Perhaps you can answer this question. I use AOL for my ISP and use DSL. When I sign on to AOL I often have a time lag and my sign on page can take some time to fully display its graphics. I have tried AOL fixes, but no help. Do you think the delay in signing on to AOL is an AOL problem or a problem with a slow PC? Thanks again for your reply. Jerry "Dapper Dan" wrote: Jerry If you have an intermediate skill level, you should be able to improve the slow operation yourself. Take a look at the following site as a starter and then as you progress, come back with specifics; guys like Noel and Mike, and a few others, have a wealth of knowledge that they are eager to share. http://www.burzurq.com/forum/trevtweak.html Bonne chance "Jerry" wrote in message ... Slow PC (Windows Me) Having an intermediate skill level for PCs, I employ the common maintenance practices to keep my PC operating smoothly. Often I get flyers in the from PC groups offering their services. One of their services is to fix a slow operating PC. Short of reformatting and reinstalling an operating system, what would these groups do to a slow PC that I would not have done? Thanks, Jerry |
#12
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Slow PC
FWIW, ME worked fine with me on AOL and dialup - but I've no experience of
AOL on ADSL (except for one client system that I'd rather forget!), let alone ME/AOL/ADSL Getting out from AOL is awkward, and a wrench - but it's something that you have to do if you want to 'mature' into the true internet experience The biggest problem for ME has always been Norton software - which brings more custom to the NG's I frequent than any other software house WRT ME. The version of Norton that shipped with a LOT of early ME machines was not in fact compatible (and the updated versions weren't much better). That and reduced OEM backing because they knew that it had less than a year before XP came out... and it suddenly got a bad rep that it didn't deserve. ME was never a Swan - but it was a very handsome duck -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Noel – Thanks for the added information. I know AOL has its problems and critics. However, for my use and convenience, I have tried to stick with it. Anyway, the reason I started this post was to prepare for Vista. It was my thinking that the new operating system together with a new PC would do away with many AOL delay problems. And, if that turns out to be true, I would have saved me time by not switching to another ISP. I have always had my doubts that AOL worked smoothly with Windows Me. I think Windows Me has been a problem with other applications as well. Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: Simple answer, is no - because almost none of the other ISP's have the same complex layers between themselves and the user. Why does AOL have these layers - because at one time they were needed for a reliable connection on dialup, and AOL built their business model around them, and sell huge amounts of advertising space on the interface. Why can't you use the more normal methods of connection with AOL that everyone else does? because they'd lose advertising revenue, and lose control over their customers. AOL's interface allows them currently to lockout use of routers to share the internet connection, as it does also ICS (unless you jump through a lot of hoops)- you have to pay extra for an 'upgraded' service to get the ability to share an ADSL line switched on in AOL -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Noel – How nice of you to detail AOL’s operation and confirm it with the Resource Meter, etc. And, your example of delays on a fast machine was surprising. I would not have expected that. Do other ISPs have similar delays? Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: AOL is a system hog - I know, I used it (on dialup) for 10 years! It has a habit of updating itself in the background without telling you - and reinstating applications that you thought that you had safely disabled every time you start AOL up. Said applications are frequently the cause of the slowness - and McAfee is worse than most in this respect, particularly in WIn9x systems (the only one worse is Norton, AFAIK). Next time you boot, open the Resource Meter before opening AOL, and watch the available resource drop like a stone. Open System Monitor - and watch the Kernel Processor usage climb to 100% and stay there for the lagtime, and the Swapfile in Use numbers start to climb towards the roof, and stay there. To switch screen names in AOL, the process involves (IIRC) actually unloading AOL and reloading a different instance - and this takes time. The process of starting up AOL itself is a little lesson in how not to write an application, very roughly what happens is (and this is from memory, so could be total BS!):- 1) You click the shortcut 2) this launches WAOL.exe - which in turn the checks the integrity of the installation before doing anything else, and scan your existing network connections 3) if no new connections are found, it begins to load the required background applications 4) once all the background applications are loaded, it then loads the rest of the connector, and eventually you get the request for the screenname/password 5) You click OK on the SN/PW 6)AOL then connects to the local exchange, which then connects to the US servers for verification of the PW/SN, and hands you back to whichever is you local AOL server, which deals with you from then on this then begins the download of the pages, at the same time checking your buddy list, and updating the email database. AOL has a pretty high contention ratio - so there may be a lot of user fighting for the bandwidth that you're using intensively at this time, and they have a right to at least some of it all the time. 7) Eventually, AOL has finished updating everything in sight, and updating the background apps as well, and you get the adverts popping up Even on a fast-ish machine (this one is a non-optimised 3GHz Sempron with 1GB RAM in XP running AOL9 over 1Mb/s BT ADSL) the full process can take 7 seconds to bring up the login screen, and about 15-20 seconds to do the actual login - and that's when I'm already connected to the Net, by another ISP!, add in the negotiation time required, and any slowdowns because you may be using a limited-bandwidth service, and it's easy to see where 45 seconds comes from. HTH -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Noel – The lag time is not always the same, but this is what I normally experience When I first hit the AOL logo to sign on, it can take maybe 15 sec. to get to the sign on page. Now, when I click on the sign on page, it can take maybe another 10 seconds to get to the "welcome" page. Now, to your point of AOL loading a lot of stuff, that is true. I say that because when I am on the sign on page, I can tell AOL is downloading the spyware and antivirus notification. Also, when I first hit the AOL logo and am waiting, my antivirus (supplied by AOL) is loading. So, I can understand some of this is slowing me down. However, what annoys me the most is this. When I click on the sign on page and start loading my "welcome page," all graphics appear except for one small block. And I can wait 20 seconds for it to appear. It’s the same block all the time. And then, what bothers me next is this. When I switch screen names, I have waited up to 45 seconds for the switch to be made. Now, that being said, all of the above usually are the worse at first application. So, I am thinking that after my initial sign on, AOL is done downloading programs whereby follow-up use is faster. But, I need to say also, the above delays, etc have gotten worse in the past year. So, even though AOL can be part of the problem, I am wondering if my PC is contributing some of the delays. My buddy list has two people. Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: AOL can download an awful lot of stuff before it decides to show it!! When you say 'lag' - what are we talking about? Seconds for the first page to complete display, or seconds for a number of pages to be displayed? How many people are in your Buddies list (the more you have there, the longer AOL will take to check to see whether they're online)? -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Dan – Your reference is very interesting. I can see you took some time to organize it. In addition to the information you include, you do a good job in taking time to include the key strokes to activate a feature. Perhaps you can answer this question. I use AOL for my ISP and use DSL. When I sign on to AOL I often have a time lag and my sign on page can take some time to fully display its graphics. I have tried AOL fixes, but no help. Do you think the delay in signing on to AOL is an AOL problem or a problem with a slow PC? Thanks again for your reply. Jerry "Dapper Dan" wrote: Jerry If you have an intermediate skill level, you should be able to improve the slow operation yourself. Take a look at the following site as a starter and then as you progress, come back with specifics; guys like Noel and Mike, and a few others, have a wealth of knowledge that they are eager to share. http://www.burzurq.com/forum/trevtweak.html Bonne chance "Jerry" wrote in message ... Slow PC (Windows Me) Having an intermediate skill level for PCs, I employ the common maintenance practices to keep my PC operating smoothly. Often I get flyers in the from PC groups offering their services. One of their services is to fix a slow operating PC. Short of reformatting and reinstalling an operating system, what would these groups do to a slow PC that I would not have done? Thanks, Jerry |
#13
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Slow PC
Nice sentiment.
George Gee ME was never a Swan - but it was a very handsome duck -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) |
#14
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Slow PC
"Getting out from AOL is awkward, and a wrench --"
How true; that is why I have been reluctant to switch. I just need to decide. But, I understand what you have said and appreciate your comments. Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: FWIW, ME worked fine with me on AOL and dialup - but I've no experience of AOL on ADSL (except for one client system that I'd rather forget!), let alone ME/AOL/ADSL Getting out from AOL is awkward, and a wrench - but it's something that you have to do if you want to 'mature' into the true internet experience The biggest problem for ME has always been Norton software - which brings more custom to the NG's I frequent than any other software house WRT ME. The version of Norton that shipped with a LOT of early ME machines was not in fact compatible (and the updated versions weren't much better). That and reduced OEM backing because they knew that it had less than a year before XP came out... and it suddenly got a bad rep that it didn't deserve. ME was never a Swan - but it was a very handsome duck -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Noel – Thanks for the added information. I know AOL has its problems and critics. However, for my use and convenience, I have tried to stick with it. Anyway, the reason I started this post was to prepare for Vista. It was my thinking that the new operating system together with a new PC would do away with many AOL delay problems. And, if that turns out to be true, I would have saved me time by not switching to another ISP. I have always had my doubts that AOL worked smoothly with Windows Me. I think Windows Me has been a problem with other applications as well. Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: Simple answer, is no - because almost none of the other ISP's have the same complex layers between themselves and the user. Why does AOL have these layers - because at one time they were needed for a reliable connection on dialup, and AOL built their business model around them, and sell huge amounts of advertising space on the interface. Why can't you use the more normal methods of connection with AOL that everyone else does? because they'd lose advertising revenue, and lose control over their customers. AOL's interface allows them currently to lockout use of routers to share the internet connection, as it does also ICS (unless you jump through a lot of hoops)- you have to pay extra for an 'upgraded' service to get the ability to share an ADSL line switched on in AOL -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Noel – How nice of you to detail AOL’s operation and confirm it with the Resource Meter, etc. And, your example of delays on a fast machine was surprising. I would not have expected that. Do other ISPs have similar delays? Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: AOL is a system hog - I know, I used it (on dialup) for 10 years! It has a habit of updating itself in the background without telling you - and reinstating applications that you thought that you had safely disabled every time you start AOL up. Said applications are frequently the cause of the slowness - and McAfee is worse than most in this respect, particularly in WIn9x systems (the only one worse is Norton, AFAIK). Next time you boot, open the Resource Meter before opening AOL, and watch the available resource drop like a stone. Open System Monitor - and watch the Kernel Processor usage climb to 100% and stay there for the lagtime, and the Swapfile in Use numbers start to climb towards the roof, and stay there. To switch screen names in AOL, the process involves (IIRC) actually unloading AOL and reloading a different instance - and this takes time. The process of starting up AOL itself is a little lesson in how not to write an application, very roughly what happens is (and this is from memory, so could be total BS!):- 1) You click the shortcut 2) this launches WAOL.exe - which in turn the checks the integrity of the installation before doing anything else, and scan your existing network connections 3) if no new connections are found, it begins to load the required background applications 4) once all the background applications are loaded, it then loads the rest of the connector, and eventually you get the request for the screenname/password 5) You click OK on the SN/PW 6)AOL then connects to the local exchange, which then connects to the US servers for verification of the PW/SN, and hands you back to whichever is you local AOL server, which deals with you from then on this then begins the download of the pages, at the same time checking your buddy list, and updating the email database. AOL has a pretty high contention ratio - so there may be a lot of user fighting for the bandwidth that you're using intensively at this time, and they have a right to at least some of it all the time. 7) Eventually, AOL has finished updating everything in sight, and updating the background apps as well, and you get the adverts popping up Even on a fast-ish machine (this one is a non-optimised 3GHz Sempron with 1GB RAM in XP running AOL9 over 1Mb/s BT ADSL) the full process can take 7 seconds to bring up the login screen, and about 15-20 seconds to do the actual login - and that's when I'm already connected to the Net, by another ISP!, add in the negotiation time required, and any slowdowns because you may be using a limited-bandwidth service, and it's easy to see where 45 seconds comes from. HTH -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Noel – The lag time is not always the same, but this is what I normally experience When I first hit the AOL logo to sign on, it can take maybe 15 sec. to get to the sign on page. Now, when I click on the sign on page, it can take maybe another 10 seconds to get to the "welcome" page. Now, to your point of AOL loading a lot of stuff, that is true. I say that because when I am on the sign on page, I can tell AOL is downloading the spyware and antivirus notification. Also, when I first hit the AOL logo and am waiting, my antivirus (supplied by AOL) is loading. So, I can understand some of this is slowing me down. However, what annoys me the most is this. When I click on the sign on page and start loading my "welcome page," all graphics appear except for one small block. And I can wait 20 seconds for it to appear. It’s the same block all the time. And then, what bothers me next is this. When I switch screen names, I have waited up to 45 seconds for the switch to be made. Now, that being said, all of the above usually are the worse at first application. So, I am thinking that after my initial sign on, AOL is done downloading programs whereby follow-up use is faster. But, I need to say also, the above delays, etc have gotten worse in the past year. So, even though AOL can be part of the problem, I am wondering if my PC is contributing some of the delays. My buddy list has two people. Jerry "Noel Paton" wrote: AOL can download an awful lot of stuff before it decides to show it!! When you say 'lag' - what are we talking about? Seconds for the first page to complete display, or seconds for a number of pages to be displayed? How many people are in your Buddies list (the more you have there, the longer AOL will take to check to see whether they're online)? -- Noel Paton (MS-MVP 2002-2006, Windows) Nil Carborundum Illegitemi http://www.crashfixpc.com/millsrpch.htm http://tinyurl.com/6oztj Please read http://dts-l.org/goodpost.htm on how to post messages to NG's "Jerry" wrote in message ... Dan – Your reference is very interesting. I can see you took some time to organize it. In addition to the information you include, you do a good job in taking time to include the key strokes to activate a feature. Perhaps you can answer this question. I use AOL for my ISP and use DSL. When I sign on to AOL I often have a time lag and my sign on page can take some time to fully display its graphics. I have tried AOL fixes, but no help. Do you think the delay in signing on to |
#15
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Slow PC
"Jerry": Slow PC (Windows Me) Having an intermediate skill level for PCs, I employ the common maintenance practices to keep my PC operating smoothly. Often I get flyers in the mail from PC groups offering their services. One of their services is to fix a slow operating PC. Short of reformatting and reinstalling an operating system, what would these groups do to a slow PC that I would not have done? Thanks, Jerry |
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