Pc restarts after intial boot.............

[PSYCHOPIXIE]

This only happens sometimes but on occasion, after starting up once the lovely windows music comes up my pc restarts, as if I had just pressed control. alt and delete to restart. Any ideas.

[Bill Starbuck]

This could be caused by defective hardware. If the restarts are truly
random, hardware is the cause.

I suggest that you try starting Windows in Safe Mode. If the problem
NEVER happens in Safe Mode, then the problem isvery likely caused by
software and you will need to diagnose the cause. If the problem
happens in Safe Mode as well, then you should suspect your hardware.


Bill Starbuck (MVP)

[PCR]

May as well test RAM...
http://www.simmtester.com/PAGE/products/doc/docinfo.asp RAM tester
http://www.memtest86.com/ RAM tester

Here are possible software causes. It can also be a virus. Does it
happen in Safe Mode? (Hold CTRL as you boot to get the Startup Menu, or
turn it on at "START, Run, MSConfig, Advanced button".)

http://search.support.microsoft.com/kb/c.asp?fr=0&SD=GN&LN=EN-US MSKB
Search "Restarts" & Search "Reboot" & Search "Reboots";
Windows 98; Title Only; produces...

http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=148919
(148919) - When you start your computer, Windows may restart
continuously

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;229126&Product=w98
Packard Bell Computer Restarts Continuously
(229126) - After you enable Advanced Configuration and Power Interface
(ACPI) support on a Packard Bell Multimedia 4350 computer, your computer
may restart continuously.

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;304943&Product=w98
Computer May Reboot Continuously with More Than 1.5 GB of RAM
(304943) - If your computer has more than 1.5 gigabytes (GB) of memory
(RAM), the computer may reboot continuously when you try to start
Windows Millennium Edition (Me) or Windows 98. Or, when you try to
install Windows Me or Windows 98 with more than 1.5 GB of...

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;130018&Product=w98
Computer Caught in Reboot Loop After Using DriveSpace
(130018) - When you are using DriveSpace to compress a drive, your
computer may become stuck in a reboot (or restart) loop. If you press
the F8 key when your computer restarts and then choose Command Prompt
Only, your computer enters the reboot loop again. If...

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;222824&Product=w98
FIX: Windows 98: Reenumerating PCI Device Can Cause Reboot
(222824) - On a Windows 98 ACPI system, reenumerating a Peripheral
Component Interconnect (PCI) device may cause the system to crash. For
example, if a user employs Device Manager to remove a PCI device and
then refreshes, the system can unexpectedly reboot....

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;132333&Product=w98
Toshiba 4500 Reboots After Resuming
(132333) - When you are using a Toshiba 4500 laptop computer, if you
shut down Windows in Suspend mode or close the lid, Windows appears to
shut down successfully. However, when you resume Windows, the computer
reboots after a short time.

http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;132776&Product=w98
Computer Hangs or Reboots at Shutdown with NetWare Client
(132776) - With Novell NetWare Client version 4.10 (VLM.EXE) installed,
your computer stops responding (hangs) or restarts when you shut down
your computer.


--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"PSYCHOPIXIE" > wrote in message
...
|
| This only happens sometimes but on occasion, after starting up once
the
| lovely windows music comes up my pc restarts, as if I had just pressed
| control. alt and delete to restart. Any ideas.
|
|
| --
| PSYCHOPIXIE

[PSYCHOPIXIE]

I have only replaced the cd rom drive of late. I upgraded the memory months ago without problems. The problem itself only crops up on the odd occasion and come to think of it, it didn't happen when my old cd rom was fitted. Now I have a dvd drive that works fine but could that have anything to do with it. When you say hardware are you refering to everything and anything within the system unit.(My question mark key is broken..oops) I have used quite a few diagnostic programs including the manufactures one and the only problems it finds is that one of my drivers isn't signed for or something like that, basically not microsoft approved I guess but no problems found with the workings of any of my drivers etc. I think possibly there maybe software conflictions as the pc worked a treat when I first got it(it was 2nd hand but had, had a clean install) until I went installing software crazy.


This could be caused by defective hardware. If the restarts are truly
random, hardware is the cause.

I suggest that you try starting Windows in Safe Mode. If the problem
NEVER happens in Safe Mode, then the problem isvery likely caused by
software and you will need to diagnose the cause. If the problem
happens in Safe Mode as well, then you should suspect your hardware.


Bill Starbuck (MVP)

[PCR]

(a) If it is VERY infrequent, ignoring it is an option.
(b) Glance through the articles I posted.
(c) Do a Scandisk/Defrag, but don't let them constantly restart.
(d) Run a RAM test, after ensuring the chips are properly seated.
(e) Run a hard disk diagnostic app downloaded from the manufacturers
site.
(f) Wait patiently for Starbuck to return with more.


--
Thanks or Good Luck,
There may be humor in this post, and,
Naturally, you will not sue,
should things get worse after this,
PCR

"PSYCHOPIXIE" > wrote in message
...
|
| I have only replaced the cd rom drive of late. I upgraded the memory
| months ago without problems. The problem itself only crops up on the
| odd occasion and come to think of it, it didn't happen when my old cd
| rom was fitted. Now I have a dvd drive that works fine but could that
| have anything to do with it. When you say hardware are you refering to
| everything and anything within the system unit.(My question mark key
is
| broken..oops) I have used quite a few diagnostic programs including
the
| manufactures one and the only problems it finds is that one of my
| drivers isn't signed for or something like that, basically not
| microsoft approved I guess but no problems found with the workings of
| any of my drivers etc. I think possibly there maybe software
| conflictions as the pc worked a treat when I first got it(it was 2nd
| hand but had, had a clean install) until I went installing software
| crazy.
|
|
| Bill Starbuck Wrote:
| > This could be caused by defective hardware. If the restarts are
truly
| > random, hardware is the cause.
| >
| > I suggest that you try starting Windows in Safe Mode. If the problem
| > NEVER happens in Safe Mode, then the problem isvery likely caused by
| > software and you will need to diagnose the cause. If the problem
| > happens in Safe Mode as well, then you should suspect your hardware.
| >
| >
| > Bill Starbuck (MVP)
|
|
| --
| PSYCHOPIXIE

[Bill Starbuck]

The reboot can only happen if something kicks the microprocessor in a
sensitive area. One such sensitive area is in the upper reaches of
so-called "conventional memory". Well-behaved programs would never
intrude into this area. However, it is possible for a damaged program
to do things it should not do. The damaged program could be Windows
itself.

Your description seems to say that the computer does this restarting
all on its own and not because you run a program. So if you don't run
a program, a program cannot be the cause. And Windows does the same
things every time it starts. If Windows were damaged and doing
something weird, it should do the same weird thing every time it
starts.

There are some viruses that act playfully -- that is they do things in
what appears to be random situations. Is your antivirus software up to
date and have you run it recently?

My suspicion is that you are dealing with defective hardware. Software
always does the same things if it is running on reliable hardware.
Events that occur seemingly at random are usually caused by hardware
that is "flaky".

I don't see how CD-ROM or DVD could be involved because the problem
occurs when they are not running.

Bill Starbuck (MVP)

[PSYCHOPIXIE]

Thank you for your most helpful answers. I guess it's possible there may be something not quite right with windows, but I do actually have a lot of programs loading on start up(compaq diagnostic programs, roxio go back, intervideo dvd player thingy, norton anti virus) so could it not be one of those misbehaving on occasion or would it do it everytime(question mark). There have been an increasing number of illegal operations going on of late on that machine so I think that something somewhere may be corrupt. I do have an anti virus but no it is not up to date. However the machine is not hooked up to the net so how likely would it be that my machine could be infected and that be the problem(question mark). I did purchase norton anti virus 2004 or 5 I'm not sure which but I couldn't use it long term as you need to connect to the net to activate it. However during the short time it was present it found no problems. I have transfered jpeg files from floppy disks that I saved via another pc that was hooked up to the net, so I guess I could have transfered a nasty there. I know it's the cheats way out but I'm seriously considering buying a brand new pc with windows xp on it to see if that copes any better with my love of installing too much software. I have installed a lot of that free crap you can get so I guess that could have been naughty and poked windows where it shouldn't. I have already conducted ram tests and all is good.
The reboot can only happen if something kicks the microprocessor in a
sensitive area. One such sensitive area is in the upper reaches of
so-called "conventional memory". Well-behaved programs would never
intrude into this area. However, it is possible for a damaged program
to do things it should not do. The damaged program could be Windows
itself.

Your description seems to say that the computer does this restarting
all on its own and not because you run a program. So if you don't run
a program, a program cannot be the cause. And Windows does the same
things every time it starts. If Windows were damaged and doing
something weird, it should do the same weird thing every time it
starts.

There are some viruses that act playfully -- that is they do things in
what appears to be random situations. Is your antivirus software up to
date and have you run it recently?

My suspicion is that you are dealing with defective hardware. Software
always does the same things if it is running on reliable hardware.
Events that occur seemingly at random are usually caused by hardware
that is "flaky".

I don't see how CD-ROM or DVD could be involved because the problem
occurs when they are not running.

Bill Starbuck (MVP)

[Bill Starbuck]

One more detail -- It may be necessary to run a RAM-testing program
for many hours to find out whether there is defective RAM. This is
because the some portion of the RAM might be margin, working most of
the time but failing occasionally.

Bill Starbuck (MVP)

[Hugh Candlin]

"PSYCHOPIXIE" > wrote in message
...
>
> Thank you for your most helpful answers. I guess it's possible there may
> be something not quite right with windows, but I do actually have a lot
> of programs loading on start up(compaq diagnostic programs, roxio go
> back, intervideo dvd player thingy, norton anti virus) so could it not
> be one of those misbehaving on occasion or would it do it
> everytime(question mark).

Not true, as you somehat suspect. As proven by the random order
in which icons will appear in the Systray, it is not a given
as to which program will load first on startup.

> There have been an increasing number of
> illegal operations going on of late on that machine so I think that
> something somewhere may be corrupt.

Do you remember when they started,
and what you had changed immediately prior to that?

> I do have an anti virus but no it is not up to date.

That is never a good sign, but it does not mandate
that you have been definitely infected.

> However the machine is not hooked up to the net so
> how likely would it be that my machine could be infected and that be
> the problem(question mark).

Less likely, for sure, but still not impossible.
It would depend on a number of issues.
Do you install software?
Via floppy?
Via commercial CD?
Via burned CDR?
I don't need to know. You just need to be aware,
as you appear to be, that these are possible avenues of concern.

> I did purchase norton anti virus 2004 or 5
> I'm not sure which but I couldn't use it long term as you need to
> connect to the net to activate it. However during the short time it was
> present it found no problems.

Major red flag alert!! The question now becomes,
did you create the problem when you deleted?
or uninstalled? NAV 2004? or 2005?

> I have transfered jpeg files from floppy
> disks that I saved via another pc that was hooked up to the net, so I
> guess I could have transfered a nasty there.

You would need to hook up to the net and try
some of the online virus scans,
or use a current virus scanner product
to create an emergency floppy
and use that to scan your system.

> I know it's the cheats way
> out but I'm seriously considering buying a brand new pc with windows xp
> on it to see if that copes any better with my love of installing too
> much software.

You know what the result of that approach will be.
It will be similar to a reckless driver buying a new car
because the old one got slightly wrapped around a telephone pole.

What are you gonna do when the new PC carves
a new furrow in your brow?

> I have installed a lot of that free crap you can get so
> I guess that could have been naughty and poked windows where it
> shouldn't.

DLL Hell. You'll be hard pressed to get out of it.
Do you need to revert to an original system DLL or DLLs,
or do you actually need a DLL or DLLs
from another 3rd party app installed prior to
the installation of the 3rd party app(s) that caused the DLL Hell?
Tough question, no easy answer, time-consuming to resolve.

> I have already conducted ram tests and all is good.

Have you run SFC with the Advanced options enabled,
to see what it reports, even though I would suggest
not changing anything until you run it past the group for comment.

[PSYCHOPIXIE]

Thank you for your most informative answers there. I think I have been a bit of a bad owner to my pc ;) With regards to norton av 2004 or 5 I actually used my go back facility to revert the drive to the time before installation, simply because I thought uninstalling would make a complete mess of my pc. I think the illegal operations happened some time after that inccident anyway and as I install a lot of games (legit software, not anything dodgy) and then uninstall junk I no longer use I would be hard pressed to find out exactly what has gone on. When I first got the pc it worked a treat but I installed alot of free with magazine software and thats when things got shakey. I had a double lot of vxd blue screens of death on start up last night which I was able to ignore and then go back to the desk top but then screen went black and had to restart after yet more. I know some free screen savers I installed are problematic and they cause illegal operations so I have since dropped them in favour of the less exciting windows ones. Generally the pc behaves itself but when it spits the dummy out it really goes for it. I know a new pc would be a cop out and I have no intention of getting rid of or donating my current one either way but I am a sucker for black shiney new pcs and the more I see and hear about it windows xp is growing on me!! Maybe I ought to set a side two days of my time and just reformat the hard drive. I think I may only have the upgrade of win98se so how can I be sure I have the necessary disc if I were to consider doing that (question mark)

"PSYCHOPIXIE" wrote in message
...

Thank you for your most helpful answers. I guess it's possible there may
be something not quite right with windows, but I do actually have a lot
of programs loading on start up(compaq diagnostic programs, roxio go
back, intervideo dvd player thingy, norton anti virus) so could it not
be one of those misbehaving on occasion or would it do it
everytime(question mark).

Not true, as you somehat suspect. As proven by the random order
in which icons will appear in the Systray, it is not a given
as to which program will load first on startup.

There have been an increasing number of
illegal operations going on of late on that machine so I think that
something somewhere may be corrupt.

Do you remember when they started,
and what you had changed immediately prior to that?

I do have an anti virus but no it is not up to date.

That is never a good sign, but it does not mandate
that you have been definitely infected.

However the machine is not hooked up to the net so
how likely would it be that my machine could be infected and that be
the problem(question mark).

Less likely, for sure, but still not impossible.
It would depend on a number of issues.
Do you install software?
Via floppy?
Via commercial CD?
Via burned CDR?
I don't need to know. You just need to be aware,
as you appear to be, that these are possible avenues of concern.

I did purchase norton anti virus 2004 or 5
I'm not sure which but I couldn't use it long term as you need to
connect to the net to activate it. However during the short time it was
present it found no problems.

Major red flag alert!! The question now becomes,
did you create the problem when you deleted?
or uninstalled? NAV 2004? or 2005?

I have transfered jpeg files from floppy
disks that I saved via another pc that was hooked up to the net, so I
guess I could have transfered a nasty there.

You would need to hook up to the net and try
some of the online virus scans,
or use a current virus scanner product
to create an emergency floppy
and use that to scan your system.

I know it's the cheats way
out but I'm seriously considering buying a brand new pc with windows xp
on it to see if that copes any better with my love of installing too
much software.

You know what the result of that approach will be.
It will be similar to a reckless driver buying a new car
because the old one got slightly wrapped around a telephone pole.

What are you gonna do when the new PC carves
a new furrow in your brow?

I have installed a lot of that free crap you can get so
I guess that could have been naughty and poked windows where it
shouldn't.

DLL Hell. You'll be hard pressed to get out of it.
Do you need to revert to an original system DLL or DLLs,
or do you actually need a DLL or DLLs
from another 3rd party app installed prior to
the installation of the 3rd party app(s) that caused the DLL Hell?
Tough question, no easy answer, time-consuming to resolve.

I have already conducted ram tests and all is good.

Have you run SFC with the Advanced options enabled,
to see what it reports, even though I would suggest
not changing anything until you run it past the group for comment.

[Hugh Candlin]

"PSYCHOPIXIE" > wrote in message
...
>
> Thank you for your most informative answers there.

You are welcome.

> I think I have been a bit of a bad owner to my pc ;)

I see you as more of a victim of the IT industry's
lack of concern in providing an appropriate user experience.
The hoops that you are made to jump through are inexcusable.
The majority of people are incapable of brain surgery,
gourmet cooking, auto or TV repair, garden design,
safe driving, and a host of other skills.

Including computer setup and maintenance.
Or should I say, especially computer setup and maintenance?

> With regards to norton av 2004 or 5 I
> actually used my go back facility to revert the drive to the time before
> installation, simply because I thought uninstalling would make a
> complete mess of my pc.

Good plan.

> I think the illegal operations happened some
> time after that inccident anyway and as I install a lot of games (legit
> software, not anything dodgy) and then uninstall junk I no longer use I
> would be hard pressed to find out exactly what has gone on.

You are vulnerable to any badly written install software
which may have improperly overlayed a shared file
with an earlier version, as scenario which Microsoft
only seriously addressed beginning with Windows 2000.

You are vulnerable to any badly written uninstall software
which may have improperly removed a shared file.

> When I
> first got the pc it worked a treat but I installed alot of free with
> magazine software and thats when things got shakey. I had a double lot
> of vxd blue screens of death on start up last night which I was able to
> ignore and then go back to the desk top but then screen went black and
> had to restart after yet more. I know some free screen savers I
> installed are problematic and they cause illegal operations so I have
> since dropped them in favour of the less exciting windows ones.

SCR files are a common method of propagating viruses.

> Generally the pc behaves itself but when it spits the dummy out it
> really goes for it. I know a new pc would be a cop out and I have no
> intention of getting rid of or donating my current one either way but I
> am a sucker for black shiney new pcs and the more I see and hear about
> it windows xp is growing on me!! Maybe I ought to set a side two days
> of my time and just reformat the hard drive. I think I may only have
> the upgrade of win98se so how can I be sure I have the necessary disc
> if I were to consider doing that (question mark)

What is the part number stamped on the disc?

[PSYCHOPIXIE]

I'm not sure but I have opened up the box thingy before to replace the cd rom and fit more ram so I will have a look. An easier option may be just to hassle the manufacturer as I found them very helpful. The pc is a 3 year old (roughly) compaq deskpro.(yukky beige colour!!) Actually I have some compaq diagnostic nonsense on the pc, so might that hold that sort of info. I also wanted to ask what is the best thing to use to keep the fans inside the system unit dust free or at least to de-dust them. I hear people use compressed air but is that suitable for the fans(question mark). Thanks again. I should change my username to the 'corrupter' as in corrupter of pcs ;)


"PSYCHOPIXIE" wrote in message
...

Thank you for your most informative answers there.

You are welcome.

I think I have been a bit of a bad owner to my pc ;)

I see you as more of a victim of the IT industry's
lack of concern in providing an appropriate user experience.
The hoops that you are made to jump through are inexcusable.
The majority of people are incapable of brain surgery,
gourmet cooking, auto or TV repair, garden design,
safe driving, and a host of other skills.

Including computer setup and maintenance.
Or should I say, especially computer setup and maintenance?

With regards to norton av 2004 or 5 I
actually used my go back facility to revert the drive to the time before
installation, simply because I thought uninstalling would make a
complete mess of my pc.

Good plan.

I think the illegal operations happened some
time after that inccident anyway and as I install a lot of games (legit
software, not anything dodgy) and then uninstall junk I no longer use I
would be hard pressed to find out exactly what has gone on.

You are vulnerable to any badly written install software
which may have improperly overlayed a shared file
with an earlier version, as scenario which Microsoft
only seriously addressed beginning with Windows 2000.

You are vulnerable to any badly written uninstall software
which may have improperly removed a shared file.

When I
first got the pc it worked a treat but I installed alot of free with
magazine software and thats when things got shakey. I had a double lot
of vxd blue screens of death on start up last night which I was able to
ignore and then go back to the desk top but then screen went black and
had to restart after yet more. I know some free screen savers I
installed are problematic and they cause illegal operations so I have
since dropped them in favour of the less exciting windows ones.

SCR files are a common method of propagating viruses.

Generally the pc behaves itself but when it spits the dummy out it
really goes for it. I know a new pc would be a cop out and I have no
intention of getting rid of or donating my current one either way but I
am a sucker for black shiney new pcs and the more I see and hear about
it windows xp is growing on me!! Maybe I ought to set a side two days
of my time and just reformat the hard drive. I think I may only have
the upgrade of win98se so how can I be sure I have the necessary disc
if I were to consider doing that (question mark)

What is the part number stamped on the disc?

[Hugh Candlin]

"PSYCHOPIXIE" > wrote in message
...
>
> I'm not sure but I have opened up the box thingy

That would be the case, i suppose?

> before to replace the
> cd rom and fit more ram so I will have a look.

I asked you to check a disc, not a disk drive.

> An easier option may be
> just to hassle the manufacturer as I found them very helpful.

That would be my first choice.

> The pc is
> a 3 year old (roughly) compaq deskpro.(yukky beige colour!!) Actually I
> have some compaq diagnostic nonsense on the pc, so might that hold that
> sort of info.

Nonsense, because you don't know what it is, I suppose?
Why not run it and find out what it is?

> I also wanted to ask what is the best thing to use to
> keep the fans inside the system unit dust free or at least to de-dust
> them.

A small paint brush, about as wide as your thumb.

> I hear people use compressed air but is that suitable for the
> fans(question mark).

It won't hurt, but I use a brush.

> Thanks again. I should change my username to the
> 'corrupter' as in corrupter of pcs ;)

Computers are just like cars if they don't get regular maintenance.

It's "pay now, or pay more later".....usually, a lot more.

[PSYCHOPIXIE]

'box thingy' yes I was refering to the system unit. And no the compaq diagnostic program is not considered by me as nonsense and yes I do know what it does to a certain degree but I didn't find any problems there. It warning me of overheating a short while ago during game playing but I shut down, cleaned out fans(obviously pc was unplugged) and turned my heating down. The pc sits quite near to the radiator but I have moved it up a shelf and tend to keep my room cooler now.




[




QUOTE=Hugh Candlin]"PSYCHOPIXIE" wrote in message
...

I'm not sure but I have opened up the box thingy

That would be the case, i suppose?

before to replace the
cd rom and fit more ram so I will have a look.

I asked you to check a disc, not a disk drive.

An easier option may be
just to hassle the manufacturer as I found them very helpful.

That would be my first choice.

The pc is
a 3 year old (roughly) compaq deskpro.(yukky beige colour!!) Actually I
have some compaq diagnostic nonsense on the pc, so might that hold that
sort of info.

Nonsense, because you don't know what it is, I suppose?
Why not run it and find out what it is?

I also wanted to ask what is the best thing to use to
keep the fans inside the system unit dust free or at least to de-dust
them.

A small paint brush, about as wide as your thumb.

I hear people use compressed air but is that suitable for the
fans(question mark).

It won't hurt, but I use a brush.

Thanks again. I should change my username to the
'corrupter' as in corrupter of pcs ;)

Computers are just like cars if they don't get regular maintenance.

It's "pay now, or pay more later".....usually, a lot more.[/QUOTE]