Ugrade from 98 OEM to 98SE Retail [Archive]

Gary S. Terhune

February 11th 05, 09:32 PM

Down, boy. The "dumb question" in Chuck's case was his own. He wasn't
being at all rude. He really wondered why anyone would want to upgrade
to WIN98SE from FE. Fact is, I didn't consider it worth the effort until
well into SE's lifecycle, and even now, I only recommend it if specific
requirements apply.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
"Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
"Security!"
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Dan" > wrote in message
...
> Chuck, it is not a dumb question and that was quite rude and uncalled
for.
> In this newsgroup, we are caring and concerned individuals. If you
want to
> be a troll then visit the XP general newsgroup because they have
plenty of
> trolls there. Anyway 98SE gives users compared to 98 FE:
>
> USB 2.0 support through third party software
> WMP 9 (if the user wants it)
> Better software support (many games and programs now require 98SE as
the bare
> minimum)
> Better hardware support (USB 2.0, better firewire support, better
driver
> management, etc.)
> Some other stuff but this is what is on the top of my head (LOL)
>
> "Chuck" > wrote in message
> ...
> : Mouse wrote:
> : > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> : > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> : > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> : >
> : > Thanks,
> : >
> : > Mouse
> : >
> : >
> :
> : Dumb question but why would you want to?
> :
> : --
> : To reply by email remove "_nospam"
>
>

Luke

February 11th 05, 09:35 PM

On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 08:52:20 -0500, "Mouse" > wrote:

>I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
>Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
>or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?

An *update* CD worked on my old Gateway. An upgrade CD should also. Be
sure to follow _all_ directions and precautions :-).

--
Luke

Dan

February 11th 05, 10:27 PM

Okay, thanks Gary. I will cool off. :>

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
: Down, boy. The "dumb question" in Chuck's case was his own. He wasn't
: being at all rude. He really wondered why anyone would want to upgrade
: to WIN98SE from FE. Fact is, I didn't consider it worth the effort until
: well into SE's lifecycle, and even now, I only recommend it if specific
: requirements apply.
:
: --
: Gary S. Terhune
: MS MVP Shell/User
: "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: "Security!"
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
:
: "Dan" > wrote in message
: ...
: > Chuck, it is not a dumb question and that was quite rude and uncalled
: for.
: > In this newsgroup, we are caring and concerned individuals. If you
: want to
: > be a troll then visit the XP general newsgroup because they have
: plenty of
: > trolls there. Anyway 98SE gives users compared to 98 FE:
: >
: > USB 2.0 support through third party software
: > WMP 9 (if the user wants it)
: > Better software support (many games and programs now require 98SE as
: the bare
: > minimum)
: > Better hardware support (USB 2.0, better firewire support, better
: driver
: > management, etc.)
: > Some other stuff but this is what is on the top of my head (LOL)
: >
: > "Chuck" > wrote in message
: > ...
: > : Mouse wrote:
: > : > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
: > : > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
: > : > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
: > : >
: > : > Thanks,
: > : >
: > : > Mouse
: > : >
: > : >
: > :
: > : Dumb question but why would you want to?
: > :
: > : --
: > : To reply by email remove "_nospam"
: >
: >
:

Dan

February 11th 05, 10:31 PM

You can also use the update cd for 98 to 98SE that used to be available from
Microsoft for $20. I think that you can find them for sale on Ebay now but
of course they will cost more and make sure to get a product key as well.

"Mouse" > wrote in message
...
: I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
: Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
: or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
:
: Thanks,
:
: Mouse
:
:

Mouse

February 12th 05, 12:16 AM

Thanks to all who replied.
I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
OS requirement.

"Mouse" > wrote in message
...

>
> I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
>

Mouse

Gary S. Terhune

February 12th 05, 12:44 AM

OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute a
significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean" to
a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a partition/boot
manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your time
setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest 3rd-party
apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system for
daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then, somewhere
down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.

A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
option--barebones--then Upgrade.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
"Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
"Security!"
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Mouse" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks to all who replied.
> I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> OS requirement.
>
> "Mouse" > wrote in message
> ...
>
> >
> > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> >
>
> Mouse
>
>

jane

February 12th 05, 03:04 AM

Hi gary,
cute puppy.... lol.

regards Jane

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
> Down, boy. The "dumb question" in Chuck's case was his own. He wasn't
> being at all rude. He really wondered why anyone would want to upgrade
> to WIN98SE from FE. Fact is, I didn't consider it worth the effort until
> well into SE's lifecycle, and even now, I only recommend it if specific
> requirements apply.
>
> --
> Gary S. Terhune
> MS MVP Shell/User
> "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> "Security!"
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
>
> "Dan" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Chuck, it is not a dumb question and that was quite rude and uncalled
> for.
> > In this newsgroup, we are caring and concerned individuals. If you
> want to
> > be a troll then visit the XP general newsgroup because they have
> plenty of
> > trolls there. Anyway 98SE gives users compared to 98 FE:
> >
> > USB 2.0 support through third party software
> > WMP 9 (if the user wants it)
> > Better software support (many games and programs now require 98SE as
> the bare
> > minimum)
> > Better hardware support (USB 2.0, better firewire support, better
> driver
> > management, etc.)
> > Some other stuff but this is what is on the top of my head (LOL)
> >
> > "Chuck" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > : Mouse wrote:
> > : > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > : > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > : > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > : >
> > : > Thanks,
> > : >
> > : > Mouse
> > : >
> > : >
> > :
> > : Dumb question but why would you want to?
> > :
> > : --
> > : To reply by email remove "_nospam"
> >
> >
>

Gary S. Terhune

February 12th 05, 03:54 AM

No, *these* are cute puppies! (approx. 1.25 Kilos each at eight weeks.)

http://grystmill.com/pups/one_week.jpg
http://grystmill.com/pups/three_weeks.jpg
http://grystmill.com/pups/eight_weeks.jpg

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
"Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
"Security!"
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"jane" > wrote in message
...
> Hi gary,
> cute puppy.... lol.
>
> regards Jane

jane

February 12th 05, 04:18 AM

Hi,
aaaaaaaaaaaaah, aint they just darling,
mum looks so content too.
Thanks for sharing.

regards Jane

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
>
> No, *these* are cute puppies! (approx. 1.25 Kilos each at eight weeks.)
>
> http://grystmill.com/pups/one_week.jpg
> http://grystmill.com/pups/three_weeks.jpg
> http://grystmill.com/pups/eight_weeks.jpg
>
> --
> Gary S. Terhune
> MS MVP Shell/User
> "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> "Security!"
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
>
> "jane" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Hi gary,
> > cute puppy.... lol.
> >
> > regards Jane
>

Dan

February 12th 05, 04:23 AM

Very nice, Gary. My favorite picture in the bunch was the puppies at eight
weeks. That picture really showed them off well in a good light.

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
:
: No, *these* are cute puppies! (approx. 1.25 Kilos each at eight weeks.)
:
: http://grystmill.com/pups/one_week.jpg
: http://grystmill.com/pups/three_weeks.jpg
: http://grystmill.com/pups/eight_weeks.jpg
:
: --
: Gary S. Terhune
: MS MVP Shell/User
: "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: "Security!"
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
:
: "jane" > wrote in message
: ...
: > Hi gary,
: > cute puppy.... lol.
: >
: > regards Jane
:

Gary S. Terhune

February 12th 05, 04:49 AM

Yeah, well it *just* makes up for the hell they're starting to raise!
Never knew a two-pound puppy could run that fast or bite that hard!
Favorite nibble is my Achilles tendon. That or my big toe. And with
three to contend with, they like to tag-team me.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
"Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
"Security!"
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Dan" > wrote in message
...
> Very nice, Gary. My favorite picture in the bunch was the puppies at
eight
> weeks. That picture really showed them off well in a good light.

Dan

February 12th 05, 04:07 PM

Now, I am sure they are providing great fun and entertainment as well as
keeping you busy and amused. What are the puppie's names? Also, I am
reminded of Achilles from Greek Mythology, the Trojan War and the Illiad. I
studied Greek and Roman Classics in college as well as being a Cultural
Anthropology minor with an emphasis in Middle Eastern Studies. I also took
some computer courses and I have graduated from the University of Arizona
with a 3.2 GPA. I now am considering going back and either taking some more
computer courses for fun or majoring in computers and then I will really be a
force to be reckoned with in this day and age. LOL!!

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
: Yeah, well it *just* makes up for the hell they're starting to raise!
: Never knew a two-pound puppy could run that fast or bite that hard!
: Favorite nibble is my Achilles tendon. That or my big toe. And with
: three to contend with, they like to tag-team me.
:
: --
: Gary S. Terhune
: MS MVP Shell/User
: "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: "Security!"
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
:
: "Dan" > wrote in message
: ...
: > Very nice, Gary. My favorite picture in the bunch was the puppies at
: eight
: > weeks. That picture really showed them off well in a good light.
:

Gary S. Terhune

February 12th 05, 05:24 PM

Brownie, Blackie and Beauty. Temporarily. When they were first born, we
assumed they'd be given away, thus I grabbed some names that were fast
and easy. As it is, my wife has decided to keep Brownie. Perhaps she'll
rename him, perhaps she won't. Brownie is male, and will fade to a
lighter "Apricot" as he grows up. Blackie is male and will turn silver.
Beauty (my favorite) is female and has what's known as "Phantom"
markings. Black (though that may turn towards silver) with cream-colored
paws, cheeks, and eyebrows--and a cream stripe up her rear, from belly
to tail. Grandparents are all AKC Registered Toy Poodle. We haven't
bothered to register the parents, which we got from two different
breeders. Some time in the next week or two, the males are going to new
homes. Probably two elderly ladies who live down the street.

Yeah, the last couple of days they've started outgrowing the house with
their shenanigans, but it's too cold outside to leave them for long.
Been a month since the snowstorms and there's still a foot or two on the
north sides of fences, buildings, etc.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Dan" > wrote in message
...
> Now, I am sure they are providing great fun and entertainment as well
as
> keeping you busy and amused. What are the puppie's names?

Dan

February 12th 05, 05:59 PM

It is so nice to hear that you have lots of snow. I love snow but I would
hate to have to drive in it all the time. It is ironic that I live in Tucson
since I love cold weather and snow but I like the Christian church that I go
to here and right now we are being blessed by God with a great deal of rain
and I am loving life. I hope that the dogs get good homes and I think a dog
is just what you need, Gary. :>

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
: Brownie, Blackie and Beauty. Temporarily. When they were first born, we
: assumed they'd be given away, thus I grabbed some names that were fast
: and easy. As it is, my wife has decided to keep Brownie. Perhaps she'll
: rename him, perhaps she won't. Brownie is male, and will fade to a
: lighter "Apricot" as he grows up. Blackie is male and will turn silver.
: Beauty (my favorite) is female and has what's known as "Phantom"
: markings. Black (though that may turn towards silver) with cream-colored
: paws, cheeks, and eyebrows--and a cream stripe up her rear, from belly
: to tail. Grandparents are all AKC Registered Toy Poodle. We haven't
: bothered to register the parents, which we got from two different
: breeders. Some time in the next week or two, the males are going to new
: homes. Probably two elderly ladies who live down the street.
:
: Yeah, the last couple of days they've started outgrowing the house with
: their shenanigans, but it's too cold outside to leave them for long.
: Been a month since the snowstorms and there's still a foot or two on the
: north sides of fences, buildings, etc.
:
: --
: Gary S. Terhune
: MS MVP Shell/User
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
:
: "Dan" > wrote in message
: ...
: > Now, I am sure they are providing great fun and entertainment as well
: as
: > keeping you busy and amused. What are the puppie's names?
:

JKP

February 13th 05, 03:55 AM

Gary or anyone,...I'm trying to get an old win 98 133 mhz pentium 1 machine
set up with a wireless B adapter for my 4th grader.....I need to upgrade to
SE for the wireless adapter.....do you know the min system requirements for
98 SE....I'm afraid I might be wasting my time on such a dinosaur computer.
Thanks

"Gary S. Terhune" wrote:

> OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
> updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute a
> significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
> Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
> yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean" to
> a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
> system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a partition/boot
> manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your time
> setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest 3rd-party
> apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system for
> daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then, somewhere
> down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
>
> A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
> qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
> system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
> option--barebones--then Upgrade.
>
> --
> Gary S. Terhune
> MS MVP Shell/User
> "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> "Security!"
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
>
> "Mouse" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Thanks to all who replied.
> > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> > OS requirement.
> >
> > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >
> > >
> > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > >
> >
> > Mouse
> >
> >
>
>

Gary S. Terhune

February 13th 05, 04:02 AM

That speed will be OK--just. But you'll want a *minimum* of 64MB of RAM.
Smooth running would want twice that. And, you should make sure the
wireless B adapter is compatible with the existing hardware.

Do you have a model in mind? If so, have a link?

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"JKP" > wrote in message
...
> Gary or anyone,...I'm trying to get an old win 98 133 mhz pentium 1
machine
> set up with a wireless B adapter for my 4th grader.....I need to
upgrade to
> SE for the wireless adapter.....do you know the min system
requirements for
> 98 SE....I'm afraid I might be wasting my time on such a dinosaur
computer.
> Thanks
>
> "Gary S. Terhune" wrote:
>
> > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
> > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute
a
> > significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
> > Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
> > yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean"
to
> > a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
> > system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a
partition/boot
> > manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your
time
> > setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest
3rd-party
> > apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system
for
> > daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then,
somewhere
> > down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
> >
> > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
> > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
> > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
> > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
> >
> > --
> > Gary S. Terhune
> > MS MVP Shell/User
> > "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
> > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> > "Security!"
> > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
> >
> > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Thanks to all who replied.
> > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> > > OS requirement.
> > >
> > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > >
> > > >
> > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > > >
> > >
> > > Mouse
> > >
> > >
> >
> >

Gary S. Terhune

February 13th 05, 04:25 AM

Umm, let's step back for a moment--To hook into a home network, a better
solution for that machine might be a wireless switch that includes CAT5
ports.

Like this: http://www.linksys.com/products/product.asp?prid=602&scid=36

Combined with a standard Ethernet card installed in the current system,
no upgrade is necessary.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"JKP" > wrote in message
...
> Gary or anyone,...I'm trying to get an old win 98 133 mhz pentium 1
machine
> set up with a wireless B adapter for my 4th grader.....I need to
upgrade to
> SE for the wireless adapter.....do you know the min system
requirements for
> 98 SE....I'm afraid I might be wasting my time on such a dinosaur
computer.
> Thanks
>
> "Gary S. Terhune" wrote:
>
> > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
> > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute
a
> > significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
> > Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
> > yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean"
to
> > a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
> > system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a
partition/boot
> > manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your
time
> > setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest
3rd-party
> > apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system
for
> > daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then,
somewhere
> > down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
> >
> > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
> > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
> > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
> > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
> >
> > --
> > Gary S. Terhune
> > MS MVP Shell/User
> > "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
> > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> > "Security!"
> > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
> >
> > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Thanks to all who replied.
> > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> > > OS requirement.
> > >
> > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > >
> > > >
> > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > > >
> > >
> > > Mouse
> > >
> > >
> >
> >

JKP

February 13th 05, 01:33 PM

Gary
Thanks for the great suggestion ! I'm new to wireless newtworking and I did
not know about wireless ethernet birdges. I looked at the product specs on
the link you provided...should do the trick...I just have to get a PCI
ethernet adapter and plug it into the same slot I was going to use for the
wireless adapter. Cool...thanks again !

"Gary S. Terhune" wrote:

> Umm, let's step back for a moment--To hook into a home network, a better
> solution for that machine might be a wireless switch that includes CAT5
> ports.
>
> Like this: http://www.linksys.com/products/product.asp?prid=602&scid=36
>
> Combined with a standard Ethernet card installed in the current system,
> no upgrade is necessary.
>
> --
> Gary S. Terhune
> MS MVP Shell/User
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
>
> "JKP" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Gary or anyone,...I'm trying to get an old win 98 133 mhz pentium 1
> machine
> > set up with a wireless B adapter for my 4th grader.....I need to
> upgrade to
> > SE for the wireless adapter.....do you know the min system
> requirements for
> > 98 SE....I'm afraid I might be wasting my time on such a dinosaur
> computer.
> > Thanks
> >
> > "Gary S. Terhune" wrote:
> >
> > > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
> > > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute
> a
> > > significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
> > > Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
> > > yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean"
> to
> > > a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
> > > system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a
> partition/boot
> > > manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your
> time
> > > setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest
> 3rd-party
> > > apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system
> for
> > > daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then,
> somewhere
> > > down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
> > >
> > > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
> > > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
> > > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
> > > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Gary S. Terhune
> > > MS MVP Shell/User
> > > "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
> > > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> > > "Security!"
> > > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
> > >
> > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > > Thanks to all who replied.
> > > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> > > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> > > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> > > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> > > > OS requirement.
> > > >
> > > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > > ...
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Mouse
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
>
>

Mouse

February 14th 05, 12:38 PM

Thanks for the info. I'm glad I came back to this thread before going
ahead with the upgrade. I've always done clean installs of 98SE in
the past, and I didn't realize that there were issues with doing an
upgrade on a patched system. This must have caused some real
headaches for a lot of people.

I noticed you used the words "fully updated". The system I am
upgrading is partially updated. Do you know if there is a specific point
in the update continuum at which the upgrade becomes a problem, or
a specific update or set of updates that are known to cause problems
with the upgrade?

This is for a friend and I told him if he got the disk, I would install it
for
him. He has a zillion applications and data files scattered all over the
harddrive and I would like to avoid spending a huge amount of time on
this. I guess your idea of a dual-boot would take a lot less time to set
up than a clean install.

Thanks again.

Mouse

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
> OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
> updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute a
> significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
> Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
> yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean" to
> a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
> system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a partition/boot
> manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your time
> setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest 3rd-party
> apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system for
> daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then, somewhere
> down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
>
> A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
> qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
> system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
> option--barebones--then Upgrade.
>
> --
> Gary S. Terhune
> MS MVP Shell/User
> "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> "Security!"
> http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
>
> "Mouse" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Thanks to all who replied.
> > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> > OS requirement.
> >
> > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >
> > >
> > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > >

Dan

February 14th 05, 04:24 PM

First, do a complete format after backing up any needed files. Second use
the Windows Security cd that is available free from Microsoft to update you
to updates as of October 2003 and switch your letter to 4.10.2222 B from
4.10.2222 A. Third install a firewall. A free one is available from Zone
Alarm and just Google Free Zone Alarm firewall and you can get a direct link
to the site. Fourth, use Windows Update site to get latest patches. Fifth,
install anti-spyware applications. My favorite is SpySweeper by Webroot but
it costs $30 and $20 if you can get it on sale for a year's subscription.
Next, use Google to find SpywareBlaster, Adaware and Spybot Search and
Destroy from Majorgeeks which is a fairly safe site as of this writing.
Also, considering downloading Mozilla Firefox from mozilla.org to lessen your
vulnerability. You will have 256 bit encryption, tabbed-browsing, better
information on stuff regarding settings and properties, no Active X
vulnerability, etc. I use Firefox for everything but Windows Update and the
few sites that require Internet Explorer. Finally, download an antivirus
program. I like and use AntiVir but if you want really good protection it is
available from Computer Associates E-Trust and their own software firewall
and antivirus program which I use in XP PRO. of my dual-boot 98SE/XP PRO.
computer. I should have mentioned to install these programs after
downloading them but I figured that was obvious. Have an awesome day and let
us know if we can be of any more assistance!

"Mouse" > wrote in message
...
: Thanks for the info. I'm glad I came back to this thread before going
: ahead with the upgrade. I've always done clean installs of 98SE in
: the past, and I didn't realize that there were issues with doing an
: upgrade on a patched system. This must have caused some real
: headaches for a lot of people.
:
: I noticed you used the words "fully updated". The system I am
: upgrading is partially updated. Do you know if there is a specific point
: in the update continuum at which the upgrade becomes a problem, or
: a specific update or set of updates that are known to cause problems
: with the upgrade?
:
: This is for a friend and I told him if he got the disk, I would install it
: for
: him. He has a zillion applications and data files scattered all over the
: harddrive and I would like to avoid spending a huge amount of time on
: this. I guess your idea of a dual-boot would take a lot less time to set
: up than a clean install.
:
: Thanks again.
:
: Mouse
:
: "Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
: ...
: > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
: > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute a
: > significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
: > Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
: > yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean" to
: > a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
: > system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a partition/boot
: > manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your time
: > setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest 3rd-party
: > apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system for
: > daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then, somewhere
: > down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
: >
: > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
: > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
: > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
: > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
: >
: > --
: > Gary S. Terhune
: > MS MVP Shell/User
: > "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
: > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: > "Security!"
: > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
: >
: > "Mouse" > wrote in message
: > ...
: > > Thanks to all who replied.
: > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
: > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
: > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
: > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
: > > OS requirement.
: > >
: > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
: > > ...
: > >
: > > >
: > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
: > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
: > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
: > > >
:
:

Dan

February 14th 05, 04:40 PM

I should have added that I upgraded my D-Link router to a LinkSys router
which has much more hardware firewall protection. I had gotten 304 hits
towards my ZA PRO software firewall on my 98SE side. So far with this new
router and having it installed for about three weeks I have had 10 hits that
have managed to bypass the new $80 LinkSys router. I may have to upgrade my
router to an even stronger and more powerful one in the future to help stop
the hackers dead in their tracks. I so want to go on the offensive and start
knocking hackers pcs off the Internet. That would be awesome and maybe
Microsoft will someday sell software that would allow you to launch attacks
at hackers pcs by using some of your system resources against the hackers
pcs. I feel that we have sat on the sidelines too long and must now change
from a primary defensive posture into a more aggressive offensive posture.
Set me loose because I am ready to start shutting down hackers pcs. Everyone
have an awesome day.

"Dan" > wrote in message
...
: First, do a complete format after backing up any needed files. Second use
: the Windows Security cd that is available free from Microsoft to update you
: to updates as of October 2003 and switch your letter to 4.10.2222 B from
: 4.10.2222 A. Third install a firewall. A free one is available from Zone
: Alarm and just Google Free Zone Alarm firewall and you can get a direct
link
: to the site. Fourth, use Windows Update site to get latest patches.
Fifth,
: install anti-spyware applications. My favorite is SpySweeper by Webroot
but
: it costs $30 and $20 if you can get it on sale for a year's subscription.
: Next, use Google to find SpywareBlaster, Adaware and Spybot Search and
: Destroy from Majorgeeks which is a fairly safe site as of this writing.
: Also, considering downloading Mozilla Firefox from mozilla.org to lessen
your
: vulnerability. You will have 256 bit encryption, tabbed-browsing, better
: information on stuff regarding settings and properties, no Active X
: vulnerability, etc. I use Firefox for everything but Windows Update and
the
: few sites that require Internet Explorer. Finally, download an antivirus
: program. I like and use AntiVir but if you want really good protection it
is
: available from Computer Associates E-Trust and their own software firewall
: and antivirus program which I use in XP PRO. of my dual-boot 98SE/XP PRO.
: computer. I should have mentioned to install these programs after
: downloading them but I figured that was obvious. Have an awesome day and
let
: us know if we can be of any more assistance!
:
: "Mouse" > wrote in message
: ...
: : Thanks for the info. I'm glad I came back to this thread before going
: : ahead with the upgrade. I've always done clean installs of 98SE in
: : the past, and I didn't realize that there were issues with doing an
: : upgrade on a patched system. This must have caused some real
: : headaches for a lot of people.
: :
: : I noticed you used the words "fully updated". The system I am
: : upgrading is partially updated. Do you know if there is a specific point
: : in the update continuum at which the upgrade becomes a problem, or
: : a specific update or set of updates that are known to cause problems
: : with the upgrade?
: :
: : This is for a friend and I told him if he got the disk, I would install
it
: : for
: : him. He has a zillion applications and data files scattered all over the
: : harddrive and I would like to avoid spending a huge amount of time on
: : this. I guess your idea of a dual-boot would take a lot less time to set
: : up than a clean install.
: :
: : Thanks again.
: :
: : Mouse
: :
: : "Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
: : ...
: : > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
: : > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute a
: : > significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
: : > Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
: : > yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean" to
: : > a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
: : > system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a partition/boot
: : > manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your time
: : > setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest 3rd-party
: : > apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system for
: : > daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then, somewhere
: : > down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
: : >
: : > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
: : > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
: : > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
: : > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
: : >
: : > --
: : > Gary S. Terhune
: : > MS MVP Shell/User
: : > "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
: : > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: : > "Security!"
: : > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
: : >
: : > "Mouse" > wrote in message
: : > ...
: : > > Thanks to all who replied.
: : > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
: : > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
: : > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
: : > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
: : > > OS requirement.
: : > >
: : > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
: : > > ...
: : > >
: : > > >
: : > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
: : > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
: : > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
: : > > >
: :
: :
:
:

Gary S. Terhune

February 14th 05, 05:41 PM

The "dual-boot" option *is* a clean install. It's just that all you have
to do for your friend is resize the old partition, create the new, then
install, update and configure the new. He can then proceed at his own
pace installing apps, configuring and moving personal data himself,
while still having the old system still available. However, this method
is predicated on having lots of free space remaining on the drive.
You're going to shrink the old partition to half its size (using
BootItNG, for example) and then create a new partition of equal size.
If there is currently less than 60% free space, you're going to have to
do some finagling and assume that lots of what is now on the system will
get left behind. Each partition needs to have at least 10 to 15 percent
free space.

Even "partially updated" systems will exhibit the same behavior in re
updates breaking. The critical issue is how much has been updated that
is more recent than Win98SE. Does it now have IE 5.5 or IE6 installed,
for instance. With Windows Updates and Win98, there isn't any decent way
to accurately determine which updates have been broken, so you end up
having to install all of the applicable ones (using the Windows Updates
Catalog), and that's chancy because they often have to be installed in a
particular order. It can be done, but it would entail a lot more help
from you than the dual-boot method

Aside: Tell your friend that *fully* updated is the way to run Windows,
particularly in the case of Critical Updates, but also in the case of
some "Optional" updates.

Your friend would be wise to collect all the applications installers
that he needs for the new system into one folder on the old system. Or
burn them to CDs. Same for applications updates, though he'll want to
always check for newer updates than those he now has. If you install to
a separate partition, (assuming the system really have room for
one--can't make them too tight, have to leave plenty of free space on
each,) then your friend can use the old system for whatever isn't yet
installed on the new, and meanwhile access the apps installers and
personal files on the old. Friend should also take careful stock of what
he has installed and only carry over the things he really uses. I don't
know what is meant by "zillions of applications" but I'm betting that
many of them are either not used.

In all, this may *not* be the ideal way to proceed, especially if the
hard drive is cramped for space. Another hard drive is one possibility
if this is the case. They're just not that expensive these days.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Mouse" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for the info. I'm glad I came back to this thread before going
> ahead with the upgrade. I've always done clean installs of 98SE in
> the past, and I didn't realize that there were issues with doing an
> upgrade on a patched system. This must have caused some real
> headaches for a lot of people.
>
> I noticed you used the words "fully updated". The system I am
> upgrading is partially updated. Do you know if there is a specific
point
> in the update continuum at which the upgrade becomes a problem, or
> a specific update or set of updates that are known to cause problems
> with the upgrade?
>
> This is for a friend and I told him if he got the disk, I would
install it
> for
> him. He has a zillion applications and data files scattered all over
the
> harddrive and I would like to avoid spending a huge amount of time on
> this. I guess your idea of a dual-boot would take a lot less time to
set
> up than a clean install.
>
> Thanks again.
>
> Mouse
>
> "Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
> ...
> > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
> > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute
a
> > significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
> > Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
> > yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean"
to
> > a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
> > system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a
partition/boot
> > manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your
time
> > setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest
3rd-party
> > apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system
for
> > daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then,
somewhere
> > down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
> >
> > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
> > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
> > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
> > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
> >
> > --
> > Gary S. Terhune
> > MS MVP Shell/User
> > "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
> > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
> > "Security!"
> > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
> >
> > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Thanks to all who replied.
> > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> > > OS requirement.
> > >
> > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > >
> > > >
> > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > > >
>
>

Dan

February 14th 05, 08:19 PM

Gary I have found that I like to apply updates one by one except in the case
of the initial install and updating where I apply them as soon as possible.
Just so I know what is the suggested way of updating when you are starting
from an initial install and also when more than one critical update has been
released. How does an end user decide which update to apply first.

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
: The "dual-boot" option *is* a clean install. It's just that all you have
: to do for your friend is resize the old partition, create the new, then
: install, update and configure the new. He can then proceed at his own
: pace installing apps, configuring and moving personal data himself,
: while still having the old system still available. However, this method
: is predicated on having lots of free space remaining on the drive.
: You're going to shrink the old partition to half its size (using
: BootItNG, for example) and then create a new partition of equal size.
: If there is currently less than 60% free space, you're going to have to
: do some finagling and assume that lots of what is now on the system will
: get left behind. Each partition needs to have at least 10 to 15 percent
: free space.
:
: Even "partially updated" systems will exhibit the same behavior in re
: updates breaking. The critical issue is how much has been updated that
: is more recent than Win98SE. Does it now have IE 5.5 or IE6 installed,
: for instance. With Windows Updates and Win98, there isn't any decent way
: to accurately determine which updates have been broken, so you end up
: having to install all of the applicable ones (using the Windows Updates
: Catalog), and that's chancy because they often have to be installed in a
: particular order. It can be done, but it would entail a lot more help
: from you than the dual-boot method
:
: Aside: Tell your friend that *fully* updated is the way to run Windows,
: particularly in the case of Critical Updates, but also in the case of
: some "Optional" updates.
:
: Your friend would be wise to collect all the applications installers
: that he needs for the new system into one folder on the old system. Or
: burn them to CDs. Same for applications updates, though he'll want to
: always check for newer updates than those he now has. If you install to
: a separate partition, (assuming the system really have room for
: one--can't make them too tight, have to leave plenty of free space on
: each,) then your friend can use the old system for whatever isn't yet
: installed on the new, and meanwhile access the apps installers and
: personal files on the old. Friend should also take careful stock of what
: he has installed and only carry over the things he really uses. I don't
: know what is meant by "zillions of applications" but I'm betting that
: many of them are either not used.
:
: In all, this may *not* be the ideal way to proceed, especially if the
: hard drive is cramped for space. Another hard drive is one possibility
: if this is the case. They're just not that expensive these days.
:
: --
: Gary S. Terhune
: MS MVP Shell/User
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
:
: "Mouse" > wrote in message
: ...
: > Thanks for the info. I'm glad I came back to this thread before going
: > ahead with the upgrade. I've always done clean installs of 98SE in
: > the past, and I didn't realize that there were issues with doing an
: > upgrade on a patched system. This must have caused some real
: > headaches for a lot of people.
: >
: > I noticed you used the words "fully updated". The system I am
: > upgrading is partially updated. Do you know if there is a specific
: point
: > in the update continuum at which the upgrade becomes a problem, or
: > a specific update or set of updates that are known to cause problems
: > with the upgrade?
: >
: > This is for a friend and I told him if he got the disk, I would
: install it
: > for
: > him. He has a zillion applications and data files scattered all over
: the
: > harddrive and I would like to avoid spending a huge amount of time on
: > this. I guess your idea of a dual-boot would take a lot less time to
: set
: > up than a clean install.
: >
: > Thanks again.
: >
: > Mouse
: >
: > "Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
: > ...
: > > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
: > > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute
: a
: > > significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken, and DLL
: > > Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will find
: > > yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE "clean"
: to
: > > a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat your current
: > > system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using a
: partition/boot
: > > manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.) You can then take your
: time
: > > setting up SE just the way you like it, installing the latest
: 3rd-party
: > > apps like AcroReader, etc., while still retaining your old system
: for
: > > daily use until you get the new one set up just right. Then,
: somewhere
: > > down the line, you can delete the old system and recover the space.
: > >
: > > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
: > > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
: > > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
: > > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
: > >
: > > --
: > > Gary S. Terhune
: > > MS MVP Shell/User
: > > "Clean Boot--What it is and why you need it."
: > > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: > > "Security!"
: > > http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
: > >
: > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
: > > ...
: > > > Thanks to all who replied.
: > > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
: > > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
: > > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
: > > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
: > > > OS requirement.
: > > >
: > > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
: > > > ...
: > > >
: > > > >
: > > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
: > > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
: > > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
: > > > >
: >
: >
:

Bill in Co.

February 14th 05, 10:19 PM

Dan wrote:
> Gary I have found that I like to apply updates one by one except in the
case
> of the initial install and updating where I apply them as soon as
possible.
> Just so I know what is the suggested way of updating when you are starting
> from an initial install and also when more than one critical update has
been
> released. How does an end user decide which update to apply first.

(I can tell ya, but I don't think you want to hear my answer). LOL.

Gary S. Terhune

February 14th 05, 11:20 PM

First thing *I* do is update IE to the latest version. That and DX, WMP,
etc. Removes a lot of items from the list in one fell swoop and or gives
you a new list that you would eventually had to apply, but which didn't
yet have the pre-reqs present. And, of course, there is the Windows
Updates Security CD that will take care of most of it.

Outside of that, there is no simple way of knowing. Date is a reasonable
factor to consider, but then, many handfuls of updates are released on
Tuesdays. Which comes first? Also, date can be weird because of the
following situation:

Update B is predicated upon Update A, but then Update A gets superseded
by Update C. C comes after A, but should be installed before A. In
reality this isn't a common scenario, and C will have been configured to
install after B, usually--or will supersede *both* A and B. But stranger
things have been known to happen--probably the source of more than one
"problem" update.

Me, I would tear the updates apart and do some comparison of the files
they contain, looking it all up, reading all the literature to get the
gist of the history involved. Or, just let Windows Updates handle it.
I'm not nearly so anal about running a fresh backup after each
individual update, I'd back up before the update session and revert
entirely if something gets hinky.

Or you can pick the earliest, backup before each one, keep dozens of
full backups and pray. And let *lots* of time go by between each backup
so you can find out if anything went wrong and restore from backup. It
does absolutely no good to backup, update, backup, update, etc., for a
dozen updates in immediate progression. Consider that handful of updates
one single update for backup and restoration (and testing) purposes.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Bill in Co." > wrote in message
...
> Dan wrote:
> > Gary I have found that I like to apply updates one by one except in
the
> case
> > of the initial install and updating where I apply them as soon as
> possible.
> > Just so I know what is the suggested way of updating when you are
starting
> > from an initial install and also when more than one critical update
has
> been
> > released. How does an end user decide which update to apply first.
>
> (I can tell ya, but I don't think you want to hear my answer). LOL.
>
>

Dan

February 14th 05, 11:44 PM

Thanks Gary. Perhaps in the future, Microsoft can have some kind of
lettering or numbering system to suggest which update to apply first. Have a
great night!

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
: First thing *I* do is update IE to the latest version. That and DX, WMP,
: etc. Removes a lot of items from the list in one fell swoop and or gives
: you a new list that you would eventually had to apply, but which didn't
: yet have the pre-reqs present. And, of course, there is the Windows
: Updates Security CD that will take care of most of it.
:
: Outside of that, there is no simple way of knowing. Date is a reasonable
: factor to consider, but then, many handfuls of updates are released on
: Tuesdays. Which comes first? Also, date can be weird because of the
: following situation:
:
: Update B is predicated upon Update A, but then Update A gets superseded
: by Update C. C comes after A, but should be installed before A. In
: reality this isn't a common scenario, and C will have been configured to
: install after B, usually--or will supersede *both* A and B. But stranger
: things have been known to happen--probably the source of more than one
: "problem" update.
:
: Me, I would tear the updates apart and do some comparison of the files
: they contain, looking it all up, reading all the literature to get the
: gist of the history involved. Or, just let Windows Updates handle it.
: I'm not nearly so anal about running a fresh backup after each
: individual update, I'd back up before the update session and revert
: entirely if something gets hinky.
:
: Or you can pick the earliest, backup before each one, keep dozens of
: full backups and pray. And let *lots* of time go by between each backup
: so you can find out if anything went wrong and restore from backup. It
: does absolutely no good to backup, update, backup, update, etc., for a
: dozen updates in immediate progression. Consider that handful of updates
: one single update for backup and restoration (and testing) purposes.
:
: --
: Gary S. Terhune
: MS MVP Shell/User
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
:
: "Bill in Co." > wrote in message
: ...
: > Dan wrote:
: > > Gary I have found that I like to apply updates one by one except in
: the
: > case
: > > of the initial install and updating where I apply them as soon as
: > possible.
: > > Just so I know what is the suggested way of updating when you are
: starting
: > > from an initial install and also when more than one critical update
: has
: > been
: > > released. How does an end user decide which update to apply first.
: >
: > (I can tell ya, but I don't think you want to hear my answer). LOL.
: >
: >
:

Chuck

February 15th 05, 06:43 PM

Isn't electronic communication wonderful? ;-)

As Gary said, I wasn't calling the OP's question dumb. I was referring
to my own ignoranace of any benefits to SE. I've been running Win98 FE
for 6 years and never had any need to upgrade. In fact I'm running
software (Streets and Trips 2005) that specifically calls for SE but
works fine on FE.

My 98 machine is 233mhz P2, 64m, 6g HD. It needs more RAM, and a bigger
HD but I wouldn't think of investing any more $$ in such an obsolete
machine when a for little over $300 I can get a brand new e-machines
2.3g/535fsb celeron, monitor, 80g HD, and 256m RAM, pre-loaded with XP.
Then the question of FE or SE becomes moot.

Dan wrote:
> Chuck, it is not a dumb question and that was quite rude and uncalled for.
> In this newsgroup, we are caring and concerned individuals. If you want to
> be a troll then visit the XP general newsgroup because they have plenty of
> trolls there. Anyway 98SE gives users compared to 98 FE:
>
> USB 2.0 support through third party software
> WMP 9 (if the user wants it)
> Better software support (many games and programs now require 98SE as the bare
> minimum)
> Better hardware support (USB 2.0, better firewire support, better driver
> management, etc.)
> Some other stuff but this is what is on the top of my head (LOL)
>
> "Chuck" > wrote in message
> ...
> : Mouse wrote:
> : > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> : > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> : > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> : >
> : > Thanks,
> : >
> : > Mouse
> : >
> : >
> :
> : Dumb question but why would you want to?
> :
> : --
> : To reply by email remove "_nospam"
>
>

--
To reply by email remove "_nospam"

Gary S. Terhune

February 15th 05, 08:20 PM

Well... I think I'd keep that system of yours (remarkably much like my
own workhorse 98 machine, except I boosted it to 96MB of RAM) in favor
of a new eMachine.

When you finally do trade up, do your self a favor and spend a little
more than that, <g>.

You're right about this modern medium, though: As my wife was wont to
complain when we were courting via ICQ (after meeting in a Yahoo! Chat
room,
<WhineyVoice>There's no tone of voice...></WineyVoice>

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Chuck" > wrote in message
...
> Isn't electronic communication wonderful? ;-)
>
> As Gary said, I wasn't calling the OP's question dumb. I was referring
> to my own ignoranace of any benefits to SE. I've been running Win98 FE
> for 6 years and never had any need to upgrade. In fact I'm running
> software (Streets and Trips 2005) that specifically calls for SE but
> works fine on FE.
>
> My 98 machine is 233mhz P2, 64m, 6g HD. It needs more RAM, and a
bigger
> HD but I wouldn't think of investing any more $$ in such an obsolete
> machine when a for little over $300 I can get a brand new e-machines
> 2.3g/535fsb celeron, monitor, 80g HD, and 256m RAM, pre-loaded with
XP.
> Then the question of FE or SE becomes moot.
>
> Dan wrote:
> > Chuck, it is not a dumb question and that was quite rude and
uncalled for.
> > In this newsgroup, we are caring and concerned individuals. If you
want to
> > be a troll then visit the XP general newsgroup because they have
plenty of
> > trolls there. Anyway 98SE gives users compared to 98 FE:
> >
> > USB 2.0 support through third party software
> > WMP 9 (if the user wants it)
> > Better software support (many games and programs now require 98SE as
the bare
> > minimum)
> > Better hardware support (USB 2.0, better firewire support, better
driver
> > management, etc.)
> > Some other stuff but this is what is on the top of my head (LOL)
> >
> > "Chuck" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > : Mouse wrote:
> > : > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > : > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > : > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > : >
> > : > Thanks,
> > : >
> > : > Mouse
> > : >
> > : >
> > :
> > : Dumb question but why would you want to?
> > :
> > : --
> > : To reply by email remove "_nospam"
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> To reply by email remove "_nospam"

Mouse

February 16th 05, 08:13 AM

Thanks for the additional info on upgrades breaking updates.

I've decided to give him one of my extra hard drives, install it
as a second drive, set it up as a dual-boot system, configure
the USB 2.0, run that update CD that MS gave away a while
ago, and let him take it from there.

Mouse

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
> The "dual-boot" option *is* a clean install. It's just that all you have
> to do for your friend is resize the old partition, create the new, then
> install, update and configure the new. He can then proceed at his own
> pace installing apps, configuring and moving personal data himself,
> while still having the old system still available. However, this method
> is predicated on having lots of free space remaining on the drive.
>
><snip>
>
> Even "partially updated" systems will exhibit the same behavior in re
> updates breaking. The critical issue is how much has been updated that
> is more recent than Win98SE. Does it now have IE 5.5 or IE6 installed,
> for instance. With Windows Updates and Win98, there isn't any decent way
> to accurately determine which updates have been broken, so you end up
> having to install all of the applicable ones (using the Windows Updates
> Catalog), and that's chancy because they often have to be installed in a
> particular order. It can be done, but it would entail a lot more help
> from you than the dual-boot method
>
><snip>
>
> In all, this may *not* be the ideal way to proceed, especially if the
> hard drive is cramped for space. Another hard drive is one possibility
> if this is the case. They're just not that expensive these days.
>
> --
> Gary S. Terhune
>
> "Mouse" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Thanks for the info. I'm glad I came back to this thread before going
> > ahead with the upgrade. I've always done clean installs of 98SE in
> > the past, and I didn't realize that there were issues with doing an
> > upgrade on a patched system. This must have caused some real
> > headaches for a lot of people.
> >
> > I noticed you used the words "fully updated". The system I am
> > upgrading is partially updated. Do you know if there is a specific
> > point in the update continuum at which the upgrade becomes a
> > problem, or a specific update or set of updates that are known
> > to cause problems with the upgrade?
> >
> > This is for a friend and I told him if he got the disk, I would
> > install it for him. He has a zillion applications and data files
> > scattered all over the harddrive and I would like to avoid
> > spending a huge amount of time on this. I guess your idea
> > of a dual-boot would take a lot less time to set up than a
> > clean install.
> >
> > Thanks again.
> >
> > Mouse
> >
> > "Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a fully
> > > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually constitute
> > > a significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken,
> > > and DLL Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses. You will
> > > find yourself with a much healthier system if you install Win98SE
> > > "clean" to a freshly formatted partition. You can either reformat
> > > your current system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario using
> > > a partition/boot manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.)
> > > You can then take your time setting up SE just the way you like it,
> > > installing the latest 3rd-party apps like AcroReader, etc., while
> > > still retaining your old system for daily use until you get the new
> > > one set up just right. Then, somewhere down the line, you can
> > > delete the old system and recover the space.
> > >
> > > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup your
> > > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with your
> > > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
> > > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Gary S. Terhune
> > >
> > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > > Thanks to all who replied.
> > > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> > > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> > > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> > > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> > > > OS requirement.
> > > >
> > > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > > ...
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade CD,
> > > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > > > >

Chuck

February 16th 05, 03:04 PM

Gary S. Terhune wrote:
> Well... I think I'd keep that system of yours (remarkably much like my
> own workhorse 98 machine, except I boosted it to 96MB of RAM) in favor
> of a new eMachine.
>
> When you finally do trade up, do your self a favor and spend a little
> more than that, <g>.
>
> You're right about this modern medium, though: As my wife was wont to
> complain when we were courting via ICQ (after meeting in a Yahoo! Chat
> room,
> <WhineyVoice>There's no tone of voice...></WineyVoice>
>

The performance on my current machine is just intolerable any more. I'll
no doubt buy that new eMachine with XP Home, and after copying all of
my documents off of the old one, I'll turn it into a linux server.

I just wish I could speed up my Internet connection. I'm trying to set
up my wife's eBay business while limping along with 56k dial up. DSL is
not available and I refuse to install cable. I had it for the TV a few
years back but every time lightning struck in my neighborhood we'd get
arcing in the back of all the TVs. The cable company insists they're
grounded properly and there must be something wrong with our house's
wiring, but the moment I switched to satellite it stopped. Of course the
TV's and VCR's destroyed by lightning the cable company took no
responsibility for.
--
To reply by email remove "_nospam"

Gary S. Terhune

February 16th 05, 05:41 PM

Again, I recommend you spend a bit more and get something besides a
rock-bottom eMachine.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Chuck" > wrote in message
...
> The performance on my current machine is just intolerable any more.
I'll
> no doubt buy that new eMachine with XP Home, and after copying all
of
> my documents off of the old one, I'll turn it into a linux server.
>
> I just wish I could speed up my Internet connection. I'm trying to set
> up my wife's eBay business while limping along with 56k dial up. DSL
is
> not available and I refuse to install cable. I had it for the TV a few
> years back but every time lightning struck in my neighborhood we'd get
> arcing in the back of all the TVs. The cable company insists they're
> grounded properly and there must be something wrong with our house's
> wiring, but the moment I switched to satellite it stopped. Of course
the
> TV's and VCR's destroyed by lightning the cable company took no
> responsibility for.
> --
> To reply by email remove "_nospam"

Gary S. Terhune

February 16th 05, 05:43 PM

Since Win9x systems don't have a built-in boot manager, I recommend
getting BootIt NG.
www.bootitng.com

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Mouse" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for the additional info on upgrades breaking updates.
>
> I've decided to give him one of my extra hard drives, install it
> as a second drive, set it up as a dual-boot system, configure
> the USB 2.0, run that update CD that MS gave away a while
> ago, and let him take it from there.
>
> Mouse
>
> "Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
> ...
> > The "dual-boot" option *is* a clean install. It's just that all you
have
> > to do for your friend is resize the old partition, create the new,
then
> > install, update and configure the new. He can then proceed at his
own
> > pace installing apps, configuring and moving personal data himself,
> > while still having the old system still available. However, this
method
> > is predicated on having lots of free space remaining on the drive.
> >
> ><snip>
> >
> > Even "partially updated" systems will exhibit the same behavior in
re
> > updates breaking. The critical issue is how much has been updated
that
> > is more recent than Win98SE. Does it now have IE 5.5 or IE6
installed,
> > for instance. With Windows Updates and Win98, there isn't any decent
way
> > to accurately determine which updates have been broken, so you end
up
> > having to install all of the applicable ones (using the Windows
Updates
> > Catalog), and that's chancy because they often have to be installed
in a
> > particular order. It can be done, but it would entail a lot more
help
> > from you than the dual-boot method
> >
> ><snip>
> >
> > In all, this may *not* be the ideal way to proceed, especially if
the
> > hard drive is cramped for space. Another hard drive is one
possibility
> > if this is the case. They're just not that expensive these days.
> >
> > --
> > Gary S. Terhune
> >
> > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Thanks for the info. I'm glad I came back to this thread before
going
> > > ahead with the upgrade. I've always done clean installs of 98SE
in
> > > the past, and I didn't realize that there were issues with doing
an
> > > upgrade on a patched system. This must have caused some real
> > > headaches for a lot of people.
> > >
> > > I noticed you used the words "fully updated". The system I am
> > > upgrading is partially updated. Do you know if there is a
specific
> > > point in the update continuum at which the upgrade becomes a
> > > problem, or a specific update or set of updates that are known
> > > to cause problems with the upgrade?
> > >
> > > This is for a friend and I told him if he got the disk, I would
> > > install it for him. He has a zillion applications and data files
> > > scattered all over the harddrive and I would like to avoid
> > > spending a huge amount of time on this. I guess your idea
> > > of a dual-boot would take a lot less time to set up than a
> > > clean install.
> > >
> > > Thanks again.
> > >
> > > Mouse
> > >
> > > "Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > > OK, you're good to go--*except* that if your system is now a
fully
> > > > updated Windows 98, installing that Upgrade will actually
constitute
> > > > a significant downgrade. Any number of patches may get broken,
> > > > and DLL Hell will surely result, even if only in small doses.
You will
> > > > find yourself with a much healthier system if you install
Win98SE
> > > > "clean" to a freshly formatted partition. You can either
reformat
> > > > your current system, or you can set up a dual-boot scenario
using
> > > > a partition/boot manager like BootIt NG (www.bootitng.com.)
> > > > You can then take your time setting up SE just the way you like
it,
> > > > installing the latest 3rd-party apps like AcroReader, etc.,
while
> > > > still retaining your old system for daily use until you get the
new
> > > > one set up just right. Then, somewhere down the line, you can
> > > > delete the old system and recover the space.
> > > >
> > > > A retail Upgrade CD can clean install by simply showing Setup
your
> > > > qualifying media (in this case, the Win98 FE CD that came with
your
> > > > system.) Worst case, you install First Edition with zero
> > > > option--barebones--then Upgrade.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Gary S. Terhune
> > > >
> > > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > > ...
> > > > > Thanks to all who replied.
> > > > > I just wanted to make sure before doing the upgrade.
> > > > > Just for clarification, I already have the retail 98SE
> > > > > Upgrade disk, I need USB 2 support, and want to
> > > > > install some software that lists 98SE as the minimum
> > > > > OS requirement.
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mouse" > wrote in message
> > > > > ...
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I have a Gateway PC that came with Win 98 installed.
> > > > > > Can I upgrade it to Win 98SE using a retail Win 98SE Upgrade
CD,
> > > > > > or do I have to use a special OEM upgrade CD from Gateway?
> > > > > >
>
>
>

Chuck

February 17th 05, 07:17 PM

Gary S. Terhune wrote:
> Again, I recommend you spend a bit more and get something besides a
> rock-bottom eMachine.
>

Is there something wrong with eMachines or are you just recommending not
buying a bare bones machine of any type?

--
To reply by email remove "_nospam"

Gary S. Terhune

February 17th 05, 08:13 PM

I'm recommending you not buy *cheap* hardware. In this, as with most
else, you get what you pay for.

Just as I usually shop for items one or two steps behind "cutting edge",
where the prices have stabilized and the technology is more tested, I
also look for prices one or two steps above rock-bottom, because
rock-bottom prices usually mean lots of cut corners.

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Chuck" > wrote in message
...
> Gary S. Terhune wrote:
> > Again, I recommend you spend a bit more and get something besides a
> > rock-bottom eMachine.
> >
>
> Is there something wrong with eMachines or are you just recommending
not
> buying a bare bones machine of any type?
>
> --
> To reply by email remove "_nospam"

Dan

February 23rd 05, 05:31 AM

You amaze me, Gary because I couldn't have said this better myself. I like
to custom build my own machines for myself because I do not want all the
added garbage that Dell or another company may add to their machine.
However, I would only suggest this route to someone who is a techie and/or
has lots of time on their hands in order to get their computer just right.
My 98SE side is almost perfect. On the other hand the XP PRO. side needs
work but it works well enough to be somewhat satisfactory. (BTW, if anything
unusual happens my red sensors go up, figuratively speaking of course. I do
not use a pop-up blocker because I do not need one and want to know if some
adware has penetrated my defenses and if I need to go down to the registry or
deeper to fix the problem. The worst case of deceptive programs that I have
seen in my experience so far is Viewpoint Media Player. I hope Microsoft
SUES this company to shut it down. It is doing a disservice to everyone by
looking very similar to Windows Media Player and only a trained eye will see
how only half the W needs to be chopped to make it a V. I hope and pray to
God that Justice is done towards the makers of ViewPoint Media Player. This
is a Warning to them to watch out because I, the Federal Government and
Microsoft are watching you and will do whatever it takes to shut you down.
Have a nice day!

GodSpeed!!!

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
: I'm recommending you not buy *cheap* hardware. In this, as with most
: else, you get what you pay for.
:
: Just as I usually shop for items one or two steps behind "cutting edge",
: where the prices have stabilized and the technology is more tested, I
: also look for prices one or two steps above rock-bottom, because
: rock-bottom prices usually mean lots of cut corners.
:
: --
: Gary S. Terhune
: MS MVP Shell/User
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
:
: "Chuck" > wrote in message
: ...
: > Gary S. Terhune wrote:
: > > Again, I recommend you spend a bit more and get something besides a
: > > rock-bottom eMachine.
: > >
: >
: > Is there something wrong with eMachines or are you just recommending
: not
: > buying a bare bones machine of any type?
: >
: > --
: > To reply by email remove "_nospam"
:

Gary S. Terhune

February 23rd 05, 07:22 AM

He's baaaack!

--
Gary S. Terhune
MS MVP Shell/User
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm

"Dan" > wrote in message
...
> You amaze me, Gary because I couldn't have said this better myself. I
like
> to custom build my own machines for myself because I do not want all
the
> added garbage that Dell or another company may add to their machine.
> However, I would only suggest this route to someone who is a techie
and/or
> has lots of time on their hands in order to get their computer just
right.
> My 98SE side is almost perfect. On the other hand the XP PRO. side
needs
> work but it works well enough to be somewhat satisfactory. (BTW, if
anything
> unusual happens my red sensors go up, figuratively speaking of course.
I do
> not use a pop-up blocker because I do not need one and want to know if
some
> adware has penetrated my defenses and if I need to go down to the
registry or
> deeper to fix the problem. The worst case of deceptive programs that
I have
> seen in my experience so far is Viewpoint Media Player. I hope
Microsoft
> SUES this company to shut it down. It is doing a disservice to
everyone by
> looking very similar to Windows Media Player and only a trained eye
will see
> how only half the W needs to be chopped to make it a V. I hope and
pray to
> God that Justice is done towards the makers of ViewPoint Media Player.
This
> is a Warning to them to watch out because I, the Federal Government
and
> Microsoft are watching you and will do whatever it takes to shut you
down.
> Have a nice day!
>
> GodSpeed!!!

Dan

February 23rd 05, 12:36 PM

That's Right! LOL!!

"Gary S. Terhune" > wrote in message
...
: He's baaaack!
:
: --
: Gary S. Terhune
: MS MVP Shell/User
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/cleanboot.htm
: http://www.grystmill.com/articles/security.htm
:
: "Dan" > wrote in message
: ...
: > You amaze me, Gary because I couldn't have said this better myself. I
: like
: > to custom build my own machines for myself because I do not want all
: the
: > added garbage that Dell or another company may add to their machine.
: > However, I would only suggest this route to someone who is a techie
: and/or
: > has lots of time on their hands in order to get their computer just
: right.
: > My 98SE side is almost perfect. On the other hand the XP PRO. side
: needs
: > work but it works well enough to be somewhat satisfactory. (BTW, if
: anything
: > unusual happens my red sensors go up, figuratively speaking of course.
: I do
: > not use a pop-up blocker because I do not need one and want to know if
: some
: > adware has penetrated my defenses and if I need to go down to the
: registry or
: > deeper to fix the problem. The worst case of deceptive programs that
: I have
: > seen in my experience so far is Viewpoint Media Player. I hope
: Microsoft
: > SUES this company to shut it down. It is doing a disservice to
: everyone by
: > looking very similar to Windows Media Player and only a trained eye
: will see
: > how only half the W needs to be chopped to make it a V. I hope and
: pray to
: > God that Justice is done towards the makers of ViewPoint Media Player.
: This
: > is a Warning to them to watch out because I, the Federal Government
: and
: > Microsoft are watching you and will do whatever it takes to shut you
: down.
: > Have a nice day!
: >
: > GodSpeed!!!
: