IP Problems on WindowsME??

[JNC]

Hi all

I visited a client today with a network of 4 PCs configured as
follows:

1st PC:
PC with internet gateway running WindowsXP Pro and fixed IP
192.168.0.1

2nd PC:
A SERVER PC running windows 98SE and fixed IP 192.168.0.2

3rd PC:
Running WindowsXP Home and fixed IP 192.168.0.3

4th PC:
Running WindowsME and dynamic IP 192.168.0.84

All PCs used the DSL internet connection of the 1st PC.
All PCs were able to access each other and use any shares setup.
All PCs connected by CAT5 to a 5 port hub
The 1st PC's internet connection was via an attached USB broadband
modem

The system was working just fine until my visit today!!!

My brief was to install a new DSLModem/Wireless/Router and add a new
notebook PC to the LAN wirelessly and enable internet connection to
it.

I removed the old hub and USB modem from the 1st PC. I then
reconfigured the Network cards of 1st, 2nd & 3rd PCs to obtain their
IP addresses dynamically from the new router.

I installed the new 3Com DSLModem/Wireless/Router using it's default
IP 192.168.1.1. In short, PCs 1, 2 & 3 were returned to full
functionality enjoying the internet connection and shares etc etc.

I then restarted the 4th PC expecting it to have a new IP in the
192.168.1.* range. After restarting I used the IPCONFIG command from a
DOS window which showed the IP address to be the old 192.168.0.84. I
tried to PING the router at 192.168.1.1 and it failed!

I restarted the PC again but still it had the IP address 192.168.0.1.
Pinging the router again failed! I then fixed the IP address at
192.168.1.84, restarted the PC and this time I was able to PING the
router however. I could not get an internet connection.

I treid setting the Gateway to 192.168.1.1, restarted the PC but still
no internet connection.

So guys, it's over to you as I'm stuck!!

1. Why wouldn't the PC obtain it's IP dynamically from the router as
all the others hadn't?

2. How the heck can this PC get access to the net through the router
as the other PCs do?

I do recall in the dim and distant past having to edit one or more of
the .ini files, but I'm not sure!

Regards

John

[N. Miller]

In article >, JNC says...

> I visited a client today with a network of 4 PCs...
<snip>
> The system was working just fine until my visit today!!!

> My brief was to install a new DSLModem/Wireless/Router and add a new
> notebook PC to the LAN wirelessly and enable internet connection to
> it.

> I removed the old hub and USB modem from the 1st PC. I then
> reconfigured the Network cards of 1st, 2nd & 3rd PCs to obtain their
> IP addresses dynamically from the new router.

And you disabled ICS. I am just checking, here; there is no need for it now.

> I installed the new 3Com DSLModem/Wireless/Router using it's default
> IP 192.168.1.1. In short, PCs 1, 2 & 3 were returned to full
> functionality enjoying the internet connection and shares etc etc.

> I then restarted the 4th PC expecting it to have a new IP in the
> 192.168.1.* range. After restarting I used the IPCONFIG command from a
> DOS window which showed the IP address to be the old 192.168.0.84. I
> tried to PING the router at 192.168.1.1 and it failed!

You didn't try the "Release All/Renew All" while you had ICS running. Pity.
It probably would have worked.

> I restarted the PC again but still it had the IP address 192.168.0.1.
> Pinging the router again failed! I then fixed the IP address at
> 192.168.1.84, restarted the PC and this time I was able to PING the
> router however. I could not get an internet connection.

I am confused, now. The first three computers had fixed IP addresses, but
the last was dynamic? I think you have it backwards. As I recall, from
running ICS about 3-1/2 years ago, it assigned IP addresses dynamically,
starting with the first free LAN IP address after the base LAN IP address.
The first computer had the base IP address, the 2nd and 3rd computers got
the next sequential IP addresses, '2', and '3', respectively. The 4th
computer would have gotten '4', had it gotten an IP address dynamically. It
must have been fixed a '84', for some reason.

> I treid setting the Gateway to 192.168.1.1, restarted the PC but still
> no internet connection.

In Network Properties for the fourth computer, where you put a fixed IP
address on the TCP/IP Properties, you also use set the "Gateway" tab for the
router IP address, you made sure that the WINS Configuration tab was set to
disable WINS Configuration, and and WINS DHCP, ***AND*** you went to the DNS
Configuration tab and manually added the ISPs DNS servers, didn't you?

> So guys, it's over to you as I'm stuck!!
>
> 1. Why wouldn't the PC obtain it's IP dynamically from the router as
> all the others hadn't?

That question doesn't make any sense; but I'll bet it should have been, "Why
didn't the 4th PC obtain its IP address dynamically from the router as all
the others had?" If I am right in my guess that your description was
backward, the first three computers were set to obtain an IP address
automatically, but the fourth one was not. That would explain what you
described.

> 2. How the heck can this PC get access to the net through the router
> as the other PCs do?

One of two things. If there is no need for a static assignment, check the
following tabs for the TCP/IP Properties of that computer:

DNS Configuraton:
Disable DNS

Gateway:
No entries. Empty.

WINS Configuration (I've seen this set wrong, so check it):
Disable WINS Resolution

IP Address:
Obtain an IP address automatically.

Before you reboot the computer, use IPCONFIG to release the IP address
lease, if it will let you. (I don't know if it will, when you set it
statically, as you did, but it won't hurt to try.)

After it reboots, it should work as the other computers do.

If it needs static IP address assignment, the tabs should be:

DNS Configuration:
ISP DNS Server NO.1
ISP DNS Server NO.2
ISP DNS Server No.3 (if applicable; most ISPs don't have three, but some
do.)

Gateway:
192.168.1.1

WINS Resolution:
Disable WINS Resolution

IP Address:
192.168.1.84

> I do recall in the dim and distant past having to edit one or more of
> the .ini files, but I'm not sure!

Things from the dim and distant past are often best forgotten.

One other thing that confused me; in the part that I snipped, you said:

"2nd PC:
A SERVER PC running windows 98SE and fixed IP 192.168.0.2"

A server in what sense? There may also be an issue here, if this is not set
up properly.

--
Norman
~Win dain a lotica, En vai tu ri, Si lo ta
~Fin dein a loluca, En dragu a sei lain
~Vi fa-ru les shutai am, En riga-lint

[JNC]

Thanks very much for the reply.

>You didn't try the "Release All/Renew All" while you had ICS running. Pity.
>It probably would have worke

No, I didn't do this. I was up against time in the end and as it's not
a critical issue I'm returning tomorrow to finish off.

>I am confused, now. The first three computers had fixed IP addresses, but
>the last was dynamic? I think you have it backwards. As I recall, from
>running ICS about 3-1/2 years ago, it assigned IP addresses dynamically,
>starting with the first free LAN IP address after the base LAN IP address.
>The first computer had the base IP address, the 2nd and 3rd computers got
>the next sequential IP addresses, '2', and '3', respectively. The 4th
>computer would have gotten '4', had it gotten an IP address dynamically. It
>must have been fixed a '84', for some reason.

The first 3 PCs did have fixed IPs. It was the last PC that was set to
dynamically obtain it's IP from the'old' ICS server. Where it got
192.168.0.84 from I don't know. I'm guessing someone had previously
set it as a fixed one and subsequently changing to dynamic kept the
same address. This is just my assumption.

The 4th PC failed to obtain it's IP dynamically as expected.

>In Network Properties for the fourth computer, where you put a fixed IP
>address on the TCP/IP Properties, you also use set the "Gateway" tab for the
>router IP address, you made sure that the WINS Configuration tab was set to
>disable WINS Configuration, and and WINS DHCP, ***AND*** you went to the DNS
>Configuration tab and manually added the ISPs DNS servers, didn't you?

I did indeed :))

>That question doesn't make any sense; but I'll bet it should have been, "Why
>didn't the 4th PC obtain its IP address dynamically from the router as all
>the others had?" If I am right in my guess that your description was
>backward, the first three computers were set to obtain an IP address
>automatically, but the fourth one was not. That would explain what you
>described.

I'm afraid it doesn't! A logical explanation but doesn't apply in this
case I'm afraid!

>One of two things. If there is no need for a static assignment, check the
>following tabs for the TCP/IP Properties of that computer:
>
>DNS Configuraton:
>Disable DNS

Did that
>
>Gateway:
>No entries. Empty.

Did that too!
>
>WINS Configuration (I've seen this set wrong, so check it):
>Disable WINS Resolution

Yup, that too
>
>IP Address:
>Obtain an IP address automatically.

and that.

>> I do recall in the dim and distant past having to edit one or more of
>> the .ini files, but I'm not sure!
>

I think it was the protocol.ini file or maybe the protocol section
within one of the other .ini files! Had to delete network entries or
something similar

>Things from the dim and distant past are often best forgotten.

At my age, these things get forgotten forever.

>One other thing that confused me; in the part that I snipped, you said:
>
>"2nd PC:
>A SERVER PC running windows 98SE and fixed IP 192.168.0.2"
>
>A server in what sense? There may also be an issue here, if this is not set
>up properly.

When I sent the original post, I knew I shouldn't have used the word
Server - it just happened to be the name of the PC.

This is a bog standard peer-to-peer LAN - Sorry about that.

Thanks once more for your time in replying.

Regards

John




On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 17:55:50 -0700, N. Miller
> wrote:

>In article >, JNC says...
>
>> I visited a client today with a network of 4 PCs...
><snip>
>> The system was working just fine until my visit today!!!
>
>> My brief was to install a new DSLModem/Wireless/Router and add a new
>> notebook PC to the LAN wirelessly and enable internet connection to
>> it.
>
>> I removed the old hub and USB modem from the 1st PC. I then
>> reconfigured the Network cards of 1st, 2nd & 3rd PCs to obtain their
>> IP addresses dynamically from the new router.
>
>And you disabled ICS. I am just checking, here; there is no need for it now.
>
>> I installed the new 3Com DSLModem/Wireless/Router using it's default
>> IP 192.168.1.1. In short, PCs 1, 2 & 3 were returned to full
>> functionality enjoying the internet connection and shares etc etc.
>
>> I then restarted the 4th PC expecting it to have a new IP in the
>> 192.168.1.* range. After restarting I used the IPCONFIG command from a
>> DOS window which showed the IP address to be the old 192.168.0.84. I
>> tried to PING the router at 192.168.1.1 and it failed!
>
>You didn't try the "Release All/Renew All" while you had ICS running. Pity.
>It probably would have worked.
>
>> I restarted the PC again but still it had the IP address 192.168.0.1.
>> Pinging the router again failed! I then fixed the IP address at
>> 192.168.1.84, restarted the PC and this time I was able to PING the
>> router however. I could not get an internet connection.
>
>I am confused, now. The first three computers had fixed IP addresses, but
>the last was dynamic? I think you have it backwards. As I recall, from
>running ICS about 3-1/2 years ago, it assigned IP addresses dynamically,
>starting with the first free LAN IP address after the base LAN IP address.
>The first computer had the base IP address, the 2nd and 3rd computers got
>the next sequential IP addresses, '2', and '3', respectively. The 4th
>computer would have gotten '4', had it gotten an IP address dynamically. It
>must have been fixed a '84', for some reason.
>
>> I treid setting the Gateway to 192.168.1.1, restarted the PC but still
>> no internet connection.
>
>In Network Properties for the fourth computer, where you put a fixed IP
>address on the TCP/IP Properties, you also use set the "Gateway" tab for the
>router IP address, you made sure that the WINS Configuration tab was set to
>disable WINS Configuration, and and WINS DHCP, ***AND*** you went to the DNS
>Configuration tab and manually added the ISPs DNS servers, didn't you?
>
>> So guys, it's over to you as I'm stuck!!
>>
>> 1. Why wouldn't the PC obtain it's IP dynamically from the router as
>> all the others hadn't?
>
>That question doesn't make any sense; but I'll bet it should have been, "Why
>didn't the 4th PC obtain its IP address dynamically from the router as all
>the others had?" If I am right in my guess that your description was
>backward, the first three computers were set to obtain an IP address
>automatically, but the fourth one was not. That would explain what you
>described.
>
>> 2. How the heck can this PC get access to the net through the router
>> as the other PCs do?
>
>One of two things. If there is no need for a static assignment, check the
>following tabs for the TCP/IP Properties of that computer:
>
>DNS Configuraton:
>Disable DNS
>
>Gateway:
>No entries. Empty.
>
>WINS Configuration (I've seen this set wrong, so check it):
>Disable WINS Resolution
>
>IP Address:
>Obtain an IP address automatically.
>
>Before you reboot the computer, use IPCONFIG to release the IP address
>lease, if it will let you. (I don't know if it will, when you set it
>statically, as you did, but it won't hurt to try.)
>
>After it reboots, it should work as the other computers do.
>
>If it needs static IP address assignment, the tabs should be:
>
>DNS Configuration:
>ISP DNS Server NO.1
>ISP DNS Server NO.2
>ISP DNS Server No.3 (if applicable; most ISPs don't have three, but some
>do.)
>
>Gateway:
>192.168.1.1
>
>WINS Resolution:
>Disable WINS Resolution
>
>IP Address:
>192.168.1.84
>
>> I do recall in the dim and distant past having to edit one or more of
>> the .ini files, but I'm not sure!
>
>Things from the dim and distant past are often best forgotten.
>
>One other thing that confused me; in the part that I snipped, you said:
>
>"2nd PC:
>A SERVER PC running windows 98SE and fixed IP 192.168.0.2"
>
>A server in what sense? There may also be an issue here, if this is not set
>up properly.

[N. Miller]

In article >, JNC says...

> >You didn't try the "Release All/Renew All" while you had ICS running. Pity.
> >It probably would have worke

> No, I didn't do this. I was up against time in the end and as it's not
> a critical issue I'm returning tomorrow to finish off.

It takes so little time it is something to think about on your next service
call. Worst case, the utility hangs while looking for data; you just kill
the process then.

> >I am confused, now. The first three computers had fixed IP addresses, but
> >the last was dynamic? I think you have it backwards. As I recall, from
> >running ICS about 3-1/2 years ago, it assigned IP addresses dynamically,
> >starting with the first free LAN IP address after the base LAN IP address.
> >The first computer had the base IP address, the 2nd and 3rd computers got
> >the next sequential IP addresses, '2', and '3', respectively. The 4th
> >computer would have gotten '4', had it gotten an IP address dynamically. It
> >must have been fixed a '84', for some reason.

> The first 3 PCs did have fixed IPs. It was the last PC that was set to
> dynamically obtain it's IP from the'old' ICS server. Where it got
> 192.168.0.84 from I don't know. I'm guessing someone had previously
> set it as a fixed one and subsequently changing to dynamic kept the
> same address. This is just my assumption.

> The 4th PC failed to obtain it's IP dynamically as expected.

Hmmm. Unless ICS has changed, I would guess that the first three PCs were
originally dynamic, and changed to static; the last originally static, and
changed to dynamic.

> >In Network Properties for the fourth computer, where you put a fixed IP
> >address on the TCP/IP Properties, you also use set the "Gateway" tab for the
> >router IP address, you made sure that the WINS Configuration tab was set to
> >disable WINS Configuration, and and WINS DHCP, ***AND*** you went to the DNS
> >Configuration tab and manually added the ISPs DNS servers, didn't you?

> I did indeed :))

Okay...

> >That question doesn't make any sense; but I'll bet it should have been, "Why
> >didn't the 4th PC obtain its IP address dynamically from the router as all
> >the others had?" If I am right in my guess that your description was
> >backward, the first three computers were set to obtain an IP address
> >automatically, but the fourth one was not. That would explain what you
> >described.

> I'm afraid it doesn't! A logical explanation but doesn't apply in this
> case I'm afraid!

With computers, there is always a logical explanation. Sometimes it just
escapes me because I didn't design the operating software; so I am sometimes
caught off guard by my habit of making unwarranted assumptions.

> >One of two things. If there is no need for a static assignment, check the
> >following tabs for the TCP/IP Properties of that computer:

> >DNS Configuraton:
> >Disable DNS

> Did that

> >Gateway:
> >No entries. Empty.

> Did that too!

> >WINS Configuration (I've seen this set wrong, so check it):
> >Disable WINS Resolution

> Yup, that too

> >IP Address:
> >Obtain an IP address automatically.

> and that.

And then what about the "Release All" to clear the lease?

> >> I do recall in the dim and distant past having to edit one or more of
> >> the .ini files, but I'm not sure!

> I think it was the protocol.ini file or maybe the protocol section
> within one of the other .ini files! Had to delete network entries or
> something similar

I have never had to edit a .ini file for TCP/IP. I did some .ini file
editing, and a couple of others, for IPX/SPX with Novell Personal Netware;
but that peer-to-peer LAN is pretty much unsupported history since Windows
95 got "networking religion".

> >Things from the dim and distant past are often best forgotten.

> At my age, these things get forgotten forever.

No. Just too much stuff in the brain, and the indexing system fails.

> >One other thing that confused me; in the part that I snipped, you said:

> >"2nd PC:
> >A SERVER PC running windows 98SE and fixed IP 192.168.0.2"

> >A server in what sense? There may also be an issue here, if this is not set
> >up properly.

> When I sent the original post, I knew I shouldn't have used the word
> Server - it just happened to be the name of the PC.

Okay. Just be consistent in the future; include all of the computers' names,
or none of them

> This is a bog standard peer-to-peer LAN - Sorry about that.

Then there is something that I have overlooked. I have never failed to get a
LAN running, and I have done some strange things that would make an MCSE, or
the like, wince. I have torn down and built up my LAN so many times I should
probably submit a resume to a tech company.

> Thanks once more for your time in replying.

Just trying to help; it seemed like I could apply some of what I have
learned. I still feel like I have overlooked something way too obvious,
though...

--
Norman
~Win dain a lotica, En vai tu ri, Si lo ta
~Fin dein a loluca, En dragu a sei lain
~Vi fa-ru les shutai am, En riga-lint

[JNC]

Just an update and conclusion for you (I hate stories without
endings)!

On my 2nd visit I first thing I tried was a release all - yup, it hung
the computer.

Anyway, to cut a long story short, this is what I did.

I removed the network card from the computer. Restarted the PC and
shutdown again. Reinserted the card and updated drivers. Did a
release_all, restarted the PC once again and hey presto!

The rest is history - it all worked.

I tend to remember these little incidents for the future - a bit like
the university of life!

Thanks for the help, I might post here again.

Regards

John

[N. Miller]

In article >, JNC says...

> Just an update and conclusion for you (I hate stories without
> endings)!

> On my 2nd visit I first thing I tried was a release all - yup, it hung
> the computer.

Hmmm. I've only experienced that hanging the process; the computer was still
responsive, and I could kill the hung process from the task manager. Oh,
well.

> Anyway, to cut a long story short, this is what I did.

> I removed the network card from the computer. Restarted the PC and
> shutdown again. Reinserted the card and updated drivers. Did a
> release_all, restarted the PC once again and hey presto!

Hmmm. Maybe the next time you run into this you should try just removing the
adapter 'virtually'. I think you can tell Windows to remove a device from
Device Manager, and it will then unload the drivers. The next time you
reboot, it will do the same thing; locate the drives for the "newly
discovered hardware". Worst case, you have to open the case anyway.

> The rest is history - it all worked.

> I tend to remember these little incidents for the future - a bit like
> the university of life!

> Thanks for the help, I might post here again.

Any time. At the least, if I can't actually offer a solution, I do get
people to thinking along different lines. And not just I; these are just
groups of users; peers, if you will, sharing ideas and experiences. No MSFT
paid staff hangs out here as a part of the job (though I am sure they do
hang out here "off the clock").

--
Norman
~Win dain a lotica, En vai tu ri, Si lo ta
~Fin dein a loluca, En dragu a sei lain
~Vi fa-ru les shutai am, En riga-lint